Author Topic: Tight 2 wrap hitch around larger diameter objects  (Read 398 times)

Andreas

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Tight 2 wrap hitch around larger diameter objects
« on: July 08, 2019, 11:18:30 AM »
Hi there,

When trying to hitch a grown tree tightly, I noticed that some simple cowhitch locks do not hold tension as well as i wanted and much less than on smaller objects ( For example xarax' cowhitch A and a locked anchor bend..)
I started to try knots, that lock more in themself rather through being pushed angainst the objects surface.
The objective was to find secure knots that are tightening very effieciently and stay tight as well on larger diameters.

The three shown below performed well.


1. The turquoise rope knot is closing the tightest i guess. (name?)

2.The mixed colour rope knot is xarax' locked cowhitch (i believe he called it simple lock)

3. The black rope knot works well too and is holding the U shape down in a neat way. It does not lock as strong as 1.  obviously, but can be closed further "manually" by pulling the working end of the finished knot backwards ... Has someone seen this before?

I'd love to know a few more with similar (better) properties. Any suggestions?
Also comments on the ones i tried are much appreciated..

Regards
« Last Edit: July 08, 2019, 09:17:25 PM by Andreas »

roo

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Re: Tight 2 wrap hitch around larger diameter objects
« Reply #1 on: July 08, 2019, 03:25:13 PM »
If you are truly just interested in a hitch for large objects that will not relax too easily, I would think you could make life easier and save rope by switching to a single wrap hitch:

https://notableknotindex.webs.com/gnathitch.html

If there is some reason you really want two wraps, a Gnat Hitch can still be used.  It would just be the finishing structure on your two wraps. 

As an aside, I often use the Gnat Hitch for lengthwise pull by using it as the finishing structure after multiple wraps.
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Andreas

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Re: Tight 2 wrap hitch around larger diameter objects
« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2019, 07:25:52 PM »
Yes Roo,
Gnat hitch work well. But it tightens much less efficiently, i guess
My post was not meant to ask for help with a hitch to a tree. That was just the lead up 😉
« Last Edit: July 08, 2019, 07:32:24 PM by Andreas »

roo

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Re: Tight 2 wrap hitch around larger diameter objects
« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2019, 08:00:15 PM »
Yes Roo,
Gnat hitch work well. But it tightens much less efficiently, i guess
My post was not meant to ask for help with a hitch to a tree. That was just the lead up 😉
Are you looking for a binding knot or tensioner?
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Dan_Lehman

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Re: Tight 2 wrap hitch around larger diameter objects
« Reply #4 on: July 09, 2019, 01:07:45 AM »
I started to try knots, that lock more in themself rather through being pushed against the object's surface.
The objective was to find secure knots that are tightening very effieciently and stay tight as well on larger diameters.

The three shown below performed well.
Did you try these knots only on the object (bare wood)
that you show?
(--and not around a real live, with bark, tree)

I'm surprised if the Xarax locked cow h. works well
in cases of less friction (but I think that I've been a bit
surprised at this knot previously).  There is a similar
finish that works more surely, taking the tail around
the SPart & collar for a 2-diameter binding.

Once can be quite misled on this venture by objects
that are nicely smooth & slick --all sorts of nice
movements of tightening occur.  Then trying the
knots on some frictive object, and ... disappointment.   :-\

--dl*
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Andreas

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Re: Tight 2 wrap hitch around larger diameter objects
« Reply #5 on: July 09, 2019, 03:37:02 PM »
Thank you Roo and Dan

.. To explain  :)
 I noticed that a few hitches that tighten well, stay tight, and open fairly easy (see first picture with a locked anchorbend and a locked cowhitch around a pole)

... fall basically apart as soon as the diameter is a bit larger (in my case an eucalipustree that is very smooth and creates very little friction, see second picture that shows the single locked cowhitch shown above already, which holds tension substentially better than the two hitches in the first picture )

I got interested in just this difference. And tried to find more knots that do the job well without tieing to the standing part only like e. g. The buntline and gnat hitch would.

 
There is a similar
finish that works more surely, taking the tail around
the SPart & collar for a 2-diameter binding.

Do I get you right, repeat the very same tuck a second time? See 3rd picture..

And yes as Dan suggested  I removed the carpet from the palm tree that i had used for testing additionally to the eucalipustree.
Hitch 1 and 2 from the initial post did not tighten well at all, only the crossed cowhitch one (black rope, in the initial post) performed well
« Last Edit: July 10, 2019, 08:56:59 PM by Andreas »

Andreas

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Re: Tight 2 wrap hitch around larger diameter objects
« Reply #6 on: July 09, 2019, 05:30:26 PM »
One more Knot that works really well. It's like #1669 but the turns around the standing part are wrapped towards the object and with an additional wrap. Thanks Dan for generally suggesting a second wrap in some post before 😉

It holds tension well (unlike #1669) and tightens more efficiently than a Gnat hitch. Already very good as a single wrap..
« Last Edit: July 10, 2019, 04:11:43 AM by Andreas »

Dan_Lehman

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Re: Tight 2 wrap hitch around larger diameter objects
« Reply #7 on: July 11, 2019, 01:08:46 AM »
There is a similar
finish that works more surely, taking the tail around
the SPart & collar for a 2-diameter binding.

Do I get you right, repeat the very same tuck a second time? See 3rd picture..

No.  The point is to get a binding that depends
ONLY on the cordage --not needing pressure
against the object (as distinguishes e.g. the
Gleipnir vs. stangle & constrictor).

In your image, starting at the cow formation
(before extending with whatever lock),
take that end roughly parallel with the collar
over the SPart and down around it & that
side of the collar to tuck out leftwards between
itself and the collar --that will be the nip for
the tail.  (And what leaves me concerned re
the Xarax extension is that it lacks such a sure
rope-vs-rope nip (can get some between the
SPart & tail positions, but that seems less sure).)

One can see such an object-independent nip
in the *reverse* ossel hitch --cf.
www.netknots.com/rope_knots/ossel-hitch
--and load the TAIL of this presented knot.


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Andreas

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Re: Tight 2 wrap hitch around larger diameter objects
« Reply #8 on: July 11, 2019, 02:57:12 PM »
Thank you Dan

 
take that end roughly parallel with the collar
over the SPart and down around it & that
side of the collar to tuck out leftwards between
itself and the collar --that will be the nip...

I wrestled with this for 20.min until I i got that you might have meant around the collar when writing "around IT"

Maybe you find something neat taking it "down around" the standing part... i didn't 😉

I'm pretty sure now, you tried to help to get to the knot shown in the picture.

Testing it showed how good it is (also how perfect my eucalyptus tree for testing is. It is not only very smooth, but also has a  slight muld inward in one place)
using fairly stiff rope it's 3 times more work to shake it loose  than the single lock mentioned before.
Edit:    it opens much easier too
... Doesn't it deserve a name?
« Last Edit: July 15, 2019, 07:56:14 PM by Andreas »