Author Topic: Autumn Bend  (Read 2066 times)

xarax

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Autumn Bend
« on: October 01, 2014, 12:12:51 PM »
   The most simple, straightforward ways to retuck a common bend, is to retuck the Tail Ends through the central opening ( symmetric bends always have one central opening ),OR to drive them through theirs or the other link s collar. In the later case, in many cases the bonus of the retucking is that the knots become more streamlined, so they do not run the danger to be caught somewhere, and can pass through a narrow hole, because the Tail Ends do not extend perpendicularily to the axis of the knot any more.
   There are dozens, literally, simple bends where the ends leave the central nub at right angles to the axis, so there are many cases where we can apply such a retucking, through the collars, and see what happens. This edition of the 'Season" bends is just an example of such an operation : A slimmer, streamlined knot, which , presumably, is more secure, re. slippage, than the parent bend.
   The interested reader may try his/her hand, and retuck, in such a way, many of the bends presented by Miles or shown in various threads of this Forum. An amusing thing is the retucking of the Zeppelin bend (1) - but, generally, most of the bends where the four ends follow perpendicular axeses are improved by this operation.

1. http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=5028.0
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xarax

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Re: Autumn Bend
« Reply #1 on: October 02, 2014, 01:56:05 AM »
   The ONE (  :) ) interested reader ( I see that the pictures were clicked only once...) may notice that this bend can also be loaded in the reverse. The reversed Autumn bend is a Fisherman knot-like bend, which is also very secure - although I think that it would be a little more difficult to untie, because its two links ( as it happens in all such bends ) are pushed / squeezed upon each other, and so the nub becomes shorter, more compact, and perhaps more tight, too. However, those two separated collars at the two very ends of the knot s nub can play the role of two convenient "handles" : we can grasp them by their rims, and we can manipulate them with ease, even if the nub has become maximally compact. ( We can "bend" the the elongated body of the nub in between them, and so we can force some ropelength of the two pairs of ends to slip inwards, and loosen the knot.)
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Luca

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Re: Autumn Bend
« Reply #2 on: October 02, 2014, 04:48:54 AM »
Hi xarax,

Personally (yesterday afternoon, after lunch,Italian time) I saw this as an "opened" form of the Ring bend...you think it's more suitable than the "closed" forms if used with slippery material-ropes ?

                                                                                                              Thanks and bye!

xarax

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Re: Autumn Bend
« Reply #3 on: October 02, 2014, 10:07:19 AM »
  I had never seen it like this till now... To form such bends ( there are MANY bends one can form by blindly following this recipe ), I simply start from well known simpler bends, and just fold the ears / re-tuck the outgoing Tail Ends, through the collars - so I proceed "normally", from the simple to the complex knots. I have no idea which bend will slip less when tied on a very slippery material, because the sharper or wider radiuses of the turns, and the interactions of the Standing with the Tail Ends may play a very significant role. For that matter, I can never be 100 % sure which of the two reversed, relatively to each other, forms of those re-tucked-though-the-collars bends is "better"... and, of course, I can not predict which will jam earlier than the other.
   TESTS - only tests can provide definitive answers, especially in the case of the many available bends we already have tied... but I do not see anybody around who might be willing to tie other people s knots, so other people s tests are a thing of the remote future.     
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xarax

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Re: Autumn Bend
« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2014, 07:26:44 PM »
   By been retucked through the collars of a simple bend, each Tail End can either point to the direction from which the Standing End of its own link is pulled (= it becomes adjacent with its own Standing End ), or to the opposite direction ( = it becomes adjacent to the other link s Standing End ). We may denote the first case as (+) and the second as (-) , because, presumably, in the former case the added turn of the Tail Ends "backwards", towards the source of the pull of their Standing Ends, will generate an even more secure bend than in the later. 
   However, this does NOT denote any relation between the two retucked bends, with the one or the other way, and the parent bend. Except from rare cases, both retucked bends will be at least as secure as the parent bend - and probably much more secure, and much more good-looking ! : the interested reader(s) may try the ABoK#1453(-), for example, and see how this already good bend becomes even better - and less ugly !  :) 
« Last Edit: October 06, 2014, 07:27:51 PM by xarax »
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Luca

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Re: Autumn Bend
« Reply #5 on: October 11, 2014, 10:58:37 PM »
Hi xarax,

To form such bends....., I simply start from well known simpler bends, and just fold the ears / re-tuck the outgoing Tail Ends, through the collars - so I proceed "normally", from the simple to the complex knots.

I noticed  only now that the so-called "water heart" ( http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=5041.msg33254#msg33254 ) is identical to the Bend D ( http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=4016.msg23919#msg23919 ).
"Opening" the Bend D we can see that it looks like a dressing of the inversed  Autumn bend:I arrived at the Bend D by a (-) retucking  through the collars of the Double Harness bend with parallel ends,coming to the dressing of this particular version of the Water bend in a fairly spontaneous way; but it is obvious that with a simple untuck of the tails of the Autumn bend(but in this case is possible,by swapping the positions of some portions of rope  of the two Overhand links,to transform the "opened" Bend D into the Autumn bend so that the roles of the standing ends and the tail ends are not exchanged)  I obtain a very different result from the Double Harness bend with parallel ends(two interlinked Overhands that slide away by pulling on the standing parts),and considering that,untucking the bend starting from other dressings, one should get some other results...basically this post is to inform that the bend from where you started to get the Autumn bend to me remains a mystery  ... :-\  :'( ( :D)

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« Last Edit: October 11, 2014, 11:18:28 PM by Luca »