Author Topic: A variation of the Bull hitch.  (Read 23485 times)

Luca

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Re: A variation of the Bull hitch.
« Reply #30 on: October 02, 2014, 03:51:18 AM »
Hi Knutern,and thanks for your last video!


The first way tying was just me cheating - that is I untied the knot, and thereafter I tied it again backwards (after playing a video of the untying in reverse).

I also often cheat in a similar way(see above,for example!) when I'm trying to figure out how to perform a TIB knot!

                                                                                                                                  Bye!
« Last Edit: October 02, 2014, 04:04:01 AM by Luca »

xarax

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Re: A variation of the Bull hitch.
« Reply #31 on: October 02, 2014, 09:48:22 AM »
... a series of diagrams illustrating how to get also the "Constrictor Bull hitch" ( it is just for "the collection" ! ) by the "Bull hitch way" method.

  Beautiful !  :) I had never tied it in-the-bight, I was satisfied with the thought it could be tied so, some way ( because the Constrictor itself is TIB, just as the Clove ), but I had never actually tied it in any way ...
  I think that the Constrictor does not jam as easily as the Clove : In order to force it jam, you have to pull the ends harder, because of the added internal friction of the more convoluted knot you have to overcome, until they are squeezed upon each other so hard they are mutually immobilized and "locked", and so neither of them can slip either way.
   Of course, the Constrictor is a tighter knot, when/if it is tied around solid, hard objects, but that is due to the fact that the ends are "locked" more effectively. Around compressible, soft objects ( around the pair of rope ends in these cases ), I think that the wraps of Clove hitch can squeeze each other, and the penetrating pair of rope ends, more tightly than the Constrictor
This is not a knot.

Knutern

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Re: A variation of the Bull hitch (Easier way to tie)
« Reply #32 on: November 08, 2014, 03:39:56 PM »
I just had one of few moment that I got creative. Why not just tying this knot starting with the Clove Hitch?
It is way easier to remember than earlier recipies, at least I think so.

Video demonstration here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wi_ShE1nt_c&feature=youtu.be
I'm aiming for knots that is secure, AND that is easy to untie.

Knutern

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Re: A variation of the Bull hitch.
« Reply #33 on: November 08, 2014, 05:05:37 PM »
I assume the talking and the length of the video makes he audience bored, so I uploaded a short version of the video. No talking.
http://youtu.be/0D2Oh3UqSZs
I'm aiming for knots that is secure, AND that is easy to untie.

Knutern

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Re: A variation of the Bull hitch.
« Reply #34 on: November 08, 2014, 08:24:32 PM »
   With thicker, one-light-colour rope, the sequence of moves would be easier to watch, I believe.
Yes, you're probably right. As you can see of the videos I have to "force" this relatively stiff rope so that it get a shape that is to be familiar.
Both light condition and the rope itself could be better, but I didn't put much work in that, only to get the idea  :D
I'm aiming for knots that is secure, AND that is easy to untie.

Luca

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Re: A variation of the Bull hitch.
« Reply #35 on: November 09, 2014, 12:07:16 AM »
Hi Knutern,and great find.

Among the methods proposed so far,this is definitely the easiest to remember.The principle seems to be the same as the method proposed by Ashley for # 1126, I had not really thought of applying it to the Clove Bull hitch!
Personally (but I still have to take confidence!) I pay something after the tying phase because I find myself having in a certain sense to dress up again the Clove hitch component around the standing ends, but again: surely I am not yet manually confident with the method, and in any case the ease to remembering, alone is worth the price.
EDIT:by pulling the legs of the loops adjacent to the Clove component,the Clove component is(or at least:is almost) self-dressing!
                                                                                                                            Bye!
« Last Edit: November 09, 2014, 12:33:11 AM by Luca »

Knutern

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Re: A variation of the Bull hitch.
« Reply #36 on: April 14, 2015, 11:08:20 PM »
Here is a short video that shows me tying the Bull clove hitch, the other way (TIB method)
Same stiff ugly rope  :P

https://youtu.be/Ht32DfWHktY
I'm aiming for knots that is secure, AND that is easy to untie.

xarax

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Re: A variation of the Bull hitch.
« Reply #37 on: April 16, 2015, 05:41:36 PM »
   The much simpler ( and, I would dare to argue, much more intuitively clear ) method shown at :
   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0D2Oh3UqSZs&feature=youtu.be
   is also TIB ! As Luca has noticed, it is, essentially, an implementation of the method shown by Ashley at ABoK#1126 - which is the one of the three somewhat "similar" TIB "tight" hitches-nooses we have, able to be loaded by both ends, or by any one end (1). The difference is that in the one you start from the Bull hitch, and in the other you start from the Clove hitch - and you transform both of them into the Bull Clove hitch.

1.  http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=5255.0
« Last Edit: April 16, 2015, 05:44:12 PM by xarax »
This is not a knot.

knotsaver

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Re: A variation of the Bull hitch.
« Reply #38 on: June 06, 2015, 08:38:27 AM »

The principle seems to be the same as the method proposed by Ashley for # 1126, I had not really thought of applying it to the Clove Bull hitch!



The same method  (ABOK #1126) can be used to tie the Bull Constrictor hitch, cited above. (I apologize if I'm writing something already written).

xarax

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Re: A variation of the Bull hitch.
« Reply #39 on: June 06, 2015, 11:21:30 AM »
   I do not like this Bull Constrictor hitch very much... I believe it is too convoluted, and, probably because of that, it can not be tightened very hard and become more effective than the ( much simpler and smaller in size/volume ) Bull Clove hitch. Such a bulky knot, with all those twisted segments, tied around two penetrating parallel lines, does not look very good to me. Moreover, I do not believe that we can exploit the tightness of the Constrictor, when we tie it around an object of a relatively small diameter : there is too much tension "wasted" within its own twists, and unable to reach to the surface of the hitched "object", the two penetrating lines.
« Last Edit: June 06, 2015, 11:22:10 AM by xarax »
This is not a knot.

xarax

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Re: A variation of the Bull hitch.
« Reply #40 on: July 24, 2015, 04:53:05 PM »
   The Bull Clove hitch is a TIB noose - and, as many TIB fixed and adjustable eyeknots, it can be tied easily and quickly in-the-bight by "haltering" the Clove-hitch-made collar. So, in order to tie it in-the-bight, there is nothing one has to memorize and remember, other than that this TIB knot, too, like many others, can be tied by following the "haltering the collar" method. I say this because many knot users ( and, unfortunately, even some knot tyers...) when they watch a video like the one shown by Knutern (1), they just attempt to "cut and paste" in their mind the exact sequence of moves, without trying to understand what they see. Perhaps a series of still pictures can show the same thing in a more clear way.
   1. Form a Clove hitch at the end of the bight. ( I show the Clove hitch in this uncommon "open" form, because in this form it can be handled easily and steadily by keeping its three crossing points between the fingers of one hand, without any danger to mingle and jumble up the two wraps. )
   2. Form the twin-line eye. Now, what you see is an eye"knot", its eye and its collar - but the two ends of this eyeknot are still bypassing the collar. They have to pass through it, and that is what the method of "haltering the collar" is meant to do.
   3. Halter the Clove-hitch-made collar : make the whole eye be "swallowed" all the way by one side ( any one of the two sides - the Clove hitch is symmetric in this ) of the "mouth" of the collar ( = of the two wraps of the Clove hitch ). Rearrange the segments, which may have been entangled during this move.
   4. Rearrange the segments of the Clove hitch, so it takes its common "closed" form. Its two ends become parallel to each other, and tangent to the surface of the pole.

1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0D2Oh3UqSZs&feature=youtu.be
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xarax

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Re: A variation of the Bull hitch.
« Reply #41 on: September 07, 2015, 12:16:48 PM »
   There are two ways some knot tyers with ego problems ( believe me, there are lots of them, I do not know why...), can "burry" a knot that they would had wished they had tied first and by themselves, but they did not :
   1. Pretend it does not exist - and be silent about it as much as possible. Of course, not even mention the name given by its author ; instead, use the strangest way to hide it under the carpet. For example : " This ( willingly non-existing knot ), is to another knot X2, what a third knot X3 is to a fourth knot X4. " :) :)  I had recently read this "brilliant" way of burying a knot, and I was impressed by its evil ingenuity.
   2. Pretend that they had tied something "similar", which, in fact, is exactly the same - and leave people to wonder where the difference is ! :)

   Now, to be fair, I do not know the real motives of Seaworthy Lass, who happens to be also the moderator of the site :
   http://www.cruisersforum.com/
   and I do not wish to suppose that he, intentionally, wished to burry the Bull Clove hitch - because he correctly identifies the difference to the "Estar hitch", and he presents it, with pictures, at :
   1. http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f116/presenting-a-new-hitch-the-estar-xx-based-on-estar-hitch-127822.html#post1566378
   2. http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/f116/presenting-a-new-hitch-the-estar-xx-based-on-estar-hitch-127822.html#post1566385

   However, he also claims that he had tied it before it was presented in this Forum, which is not what had happened.
   He also makes some funny comments about it, as that :
   " a similar hitch was put forward by a member called Xarax in the IGKT forum in January 2014 "(sic)
   ( notice the "similar" word... )
   " If he had focussed on an end line, not a mid line hitch and selected which part to make the tail for this knot (there are two options and they are not the same) and worked out how to tie it and presented it to that forum "(sic)
   ( notice the "not the same" words...)
   So, "his" knot ( which he calls "Estar-XX hitch", to honour, supposedly, me as well as the author of the completely different Estar hitch, a re-tucked Buntline hitch ), is different from the hitch shown in this thread - because, contrary to what is shown in his pictures ( I copy them, in the attached pictures - I believe I have the copy-right to do this, because they are pictures of the knot I had tied...), in my pictures, shown in this thread, I had not shown the one end shorter than the other ! :) :) :)
   Why do I tell this now ? Because I had visited this low-quality "popular" web super-market of knots called " Animated knots..."
and I got veeery ANGRY again ! The ignorants and/or idiots who run it, present 337 knots ( ! ! ! )( the "Estar hitch" and the "Gnat hitch" "best-sellers"/"offers" included...), BUT NOT THE GLEIPNIR !
   No wonder about the plagiarism of the so-called "Estar hitch" and/or stopper "variations", of which the one is the re-tucked Buntline hitch ( something totally different than the Bull Clove hitch )  and the other the Bull Clove hitch ( something exactly the same, by definition ! :)).
   So, for the record, I decided to not leave this pass without a comment.(  Some people believe that they are so much less stupid than they really are ).
   Read :
   http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=5487.0
« Last Edit: September 07, 2015, 12:28:13 PM by xarax »
This is not a knot.