Author Topic: Another variation of the TackleClamp hitch.  (Read 21738 times)

xarax

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Re: Re-tackled TackleClamp hitch
« Reply #60 on: August 25, 2015, 10:05:45 PM »
one will find specious "tightening" as the pull will just move rope around the spar, rather than tightening it in place

  I knew that this is what one would say, if he has not tied the knot enough times, or properly. ( However, you, especially, you should had known better, because you have seen this problem in your S-binder, and how it was solved in the TackleClamp hitch. ). Those "tackled" hitches may seem simple knots, when they have been "locked", but they should be handled with care, before that.
  Start from the position of the two tackled parts / four linked Us as close to each other as possible - but at the other side of the pole !  :) Remove the slack, and then start to pull the ends, perpendicularly to the pole, the one after the other. Gradually, the wraps will start to grip the pole, and their revolving around its axis / sliding on it will become hindered by the increased friction - and that, in its turn, will force the material consumed by the pulling to make them slide less but shrink more ( = shrink rather than slide ),  and so on. I am not sure you will even manage to make them approach each other as much as I did in the attached picture ( they will stop sliding/revolving and "finish" approaching each other before that ) - because I had to hang the pole by each end of the hitch, the one after the other, and step/jump on it with my full bouncing body weight, to achieve that ! :)
   If you look more carefully, you will see that this hitch is nothing but two Yoke hitches merged together. I suggest you first tie the Yoke hitch (1)( and at least a dozen times, because this two-wrap hitch, too, is not as "simple", in its tying, as it looks ), and only after you get the "feeling" of it ( and start to be able to anticipate correctly, with sufficient precision, how much it will "close" ), only then proceed to tie the re-tackled TackleClamp hitch shown here - properly, this time. 

1. http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=5474.0
« Last Edit: August 25, 2015, 10:37:34 PM by xarax »
This is not a knot.

xarax

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Re: Another variation of the TackleClamp hitch.
« Reply #61 on: September 05, 2015, 02:57:33 PM »
   To minimize the danger ( which, nevertheless, always exists... ) the two parts of the original or of this re-tackled variation or the TackleClamp hitch will not "kiss" each other, and the hitch  "closes" before its wraps become as tightly gripping the pole as possible, one should be sure he removes any remaining slack from what I have called "initial configuration", shown in many pictures of this thread. The simplest in-the-ends tying method for both knots, is the one starting from a Clove hitch, shown at the pictures of Replies # 13 and #14. In the case of the re-tackled variation, one should add the "tackle" of the central wrap at the middle of the "bottom" side of the pole - everything else remains the same.
   http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=4224.msg26058#msg26058
   http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=4224.msg26059#msg26059
   Now, the re-tackled version has the advantage that the friction the one, each time, pulled end has to overcome before/while it distributes its tension to the other parts of the knot, is less : to reach the critical centre of the tackle, the continuations of the two ends travel a shorter path on the surface of the pole. However, there is a caveat in this :
   During the alternating pull of the ends against the pole, the two parts will seldom "slide" / "walk" exactly the same distance on the surface : Due to perhaps invisible different friction characteristics of points on the rope and points on the surface of the hitched object, the one part will start constricting the pole earlier/more than the other, so the crossing point of the corresponding wrap will start to "walk" slower/less. We can always equalize the distance of the tackle from the two crossing points, by pulling the one end more than the other, when we see that this other has stopped "walking" with the same pace, and becomes tight earlier/more than its twin.
   However, even if we manage to keep the tackle in the centre of the two crossing points of the side wraps ( as I always wish/try to do, and as it happens in the pictures of the tight knot in this and a previous post ), how do we know that those wraps are equally tensioned ? Simple : We do not ! :)  We will never be so lucky to have a perfectly symmetric knot, in geometrical and structural form. We can achieve the one or the other ideal, but not both : We can even pull out more material from the one end than from the other, and so adjust the tension of the side wraps, to the degree they are almost equal - but the central tackle will not be at the exact centre any more. Or, we can pull the two ends the amount required to ensure that the tackle remains at the centre of the distance separating the two crossing points of the side wraps, but then, most probably, the one wrap will become more tensioned than the other.
   I had not presented this form of the TackledClamp hitch as an alternative to the original one, but only as a "double Yoke hitch" - and my main purpose was to show the hitch the asymmetric Yoke hitch is half of. The original TackleClamp hitch is simpler and tight enough, and it has one less degree if freedom to adjust : one needs not pay attention to the visual and/or structural symmetry of the knot, which is always there : Regarding those characteristics, the TackleClamp hitch is self-adjusting, while its re-tackled variation is not.
This is not a knot.

Knutern

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Re: Another variation of the TackleClamp hitch.
« Reply #62 on: September 06, 2015, 12:29:09 PM »
Looks like a brillint hitch, this one. But even after I remove as much slack as possible, I can't avoid one eye grow while the other shrink. Could one call this "prematurely kiss"?  ;D
Maybee a very slick rope would perform better to that hitch?
I'm aiming for knots that is secure, AND that is easy to untie.

xarax

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Re: Another variation of the TackleClamp hitch.
« Reply #63 on: September 06, 2015, 12:47:15 PM »
  But even after I remove as much slack as possible, I can't avoid one eye grow while the other shrink.

  Those "tight hitches" are meant to be tied around sleek poles, and on sleek ropes - otherwise any other hitch will do the same job.
   Perhaps you are tying it around a "thin" pole ( "thin", relatively to the diameter of the rope you use ) and the hitch is not offered enough time/space to grip, and "lock", before the two parts kiss each other. Also, when you see that the wrap the end you pull is directly connected with does not shrink as much as you expect/wish, but it is rotating more or less freely, stop and start pulling the other end. With proper, and careful, alternate pulling, you will achieve the optimum result for the rope/pole combination you use. Last but not least, remember that you have to pull the ends against the pole, that is, perpendicularly to the surface of the pole. If you pull them in an unfavourable tangential way, you may force the wraps to which they are directly connected to rotate, and "consume" the distance which separates the two crossing points, before themselves have the time/space to shrink, grip the pole, and start be tightened more than just be rotated.
   My advice is to start from the Yoke hitch, and after you acquire some experience on it, then you will start to be able to predict which of the wraps rotates more than it should, or which has already shrunk much more than the other, and it is time to equalize the tensions.
   In general, if the ordinary TackleClamp hitch locks before the "premature kiss", its tackled variation can be made to do the same - although this may require more attention.

P.S. The hitch you see in the pictures have been pre-tensioned using the pole itself as a level in a 3 : 1 mechanical advantage. and my full body weight - so each end is tensioned with about 200kg. I could nt make the two crossing points to move even one mm after this - and the flexible material of the rope has been transformed into a stiff wood, judging from the sounds it made. when I was scratching it ..:)
« Last Edit: September 06, 2015, 12:58:40 PM by xarax »
This is not a knot.