Author Topic: Becket Hitch replacement  (Read 9242 times)

Sweeney

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Becket Hitch replacement
« on: March 08, 2013, 04:31:44 PM »
I was looking for a more secure knot than a Becket Hitch to fasten then end of a line to an existing loop and came up with this. It's not new  - a similar formation tucking both ends of a Reef (Square) knot has been published a few times - but it seems to hold better than a Becket Hitch even in monofilament (tied with the aid of a small tube) where I've used a Becket Hitch secured with an overhand knot in the end of the line.

Barry

 

X1

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Re: Becket Hitch replacement
« Reply #1 on: March 08, 2013, 11:04:16 PM »
   Thee is always the humble overhand knot, that was used as a very efficient hitch at ABoK#1821 (1).
   I believe it is better to tie your knot as shown in the first picture.
   Another solution is a shape "8* hitch, where each leg passes "under" the previous one. A very simple idea, and a very easy to remember, too.

1. http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=3944.msg23390#msg23390

roo

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Re: Becket Hitch replacement
« Reply #2 on: March 08, 2013, 11:30:51 PM »
I was looking for a more secure knot than a Becket Hitch to fasten then end of a line to an existing loop and came up with this. It's not new  - a similar formation tucking both ends of a Reef (Square) knot has been published a few times - but it seems to hold better than a Becket Hitch even in monofilament (tied with the aid of a small tube) where I've used a Becket Hitch secured with an overhand knot in the end of the line.
A possible consideration here is that sometimes the eye is so small, or the mating rope so large, that you may only be able to get one pass of rope through the eye.

For greater security over a plain becket hitch (sheet bend) in such instances, a single-pass hitch may suffice.
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Sweeney

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Re: Becket Hitch replacement
« Reply #3 on: March 09, 2013, 11:39:39 AM »
Quote from: X1
   I believe it is better to tie your knot as shown in the first picture.
You're right X1 - the tuck shown in your first picture looks to be more secure.
Quote from: Roo
A possible consideration here is that sometimes the eye is so small, or the mating rope so large, that you may only be able to get one pass of rope through the eye.
I like the Gnat Hitch and would use it in the circumstances where an eye was too small for the rope to pass more than once - I've demonstrated it to a number of people in the past year and as it's started with a (pretty well known) half hitch followed by a simple tuck it's usually well received though convincing boaters that a Clove is not a good terminal hitch even for hanging fenders falls on deaf ears more often than not.

This Becket replacement arose because my grandson was trying to attach a length of split film polypropylene to a 10" spliced eye in manila (for reasons best known only to a 9 year old!). The poly rope is stiff and slippery so when I showed him how to tie a Becket Hitch it sprang loose once tension was released (even doubled). This knot was something he could easily tie and undo himself.

Barry

TMCD

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Re: Becket Hitch replacement
« Reply #4 on: March 09, 2013, 03:57:12 PM »
Why not tie the barrel knot/blood knot, it's about the best line to line knot we've got for angling.

Sweeney

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Re: Becket Hitch replacement
« Reply #5 on: March 09, 2013, 04:45:45 PM »
Why not tie the barrel knot/blood knot, it's about the best line to line knot we've got for angling.
Indeed it is but pre-tied very small hooks come with a short piece of mono and a fixed loop and and although here are many secure ways to tie the end of the main line to a loop a combination of cold wet hands, failing eyesight especially in poor light and fine line make the Becket hitch with an overhand stopper attractive - the hitch slides until the stopper engages and then the tag end can be trimmed short. In this particular case I used 30lb test line to see if it was secure because if that resists slipping then cordage definitely will. In practice I wouldn't use this knot for fishing line as it is too fiddly to tie compared to the Becket.

Barry

TMCD

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Re: Becket Hitch replacement
« Reply #6 on: March 09, 2013, 09:48:43 PM »
The Albright Knot would actually be an excellent choice in this situation, Sweeney.

Sweeney

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Re: Becket Hitch replacement
« Reply #7 on: March 09, 2013, 10:26:28 PM »
The Albright Knot would actually be an excellent choice in this situation, Sweeney.

Agreed but difficult to tie in 2 - 3 lb line "in the wild" (I only use the heavier mono for knot security testing at home, I've never fished with it). That said it's quite a while since I last went fishing though I have been asked for advice by anglers occasionally  - the 30 lb line and a large hook makes demonstrating easier.

Barry

TMCD

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Re: Becket Hitch replacement
« Reply #8 on: March 11, 2013, 12:25:42 AM »
I tied an Albright Knot using six pound mono as the backer and four pound braid as the main line. That was a PITA to tie that knot and I'm going to have to tie a few more of those connections because I'm starting to switch my reels over to braid because it's tougher than mono.

Dan_Lehman

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Re: Becket Hitch replacement
« Reply #9 on: March 11, 2013, 08:42:46 PM »
Quote from: X1
   I believe it is better to tie your knot as shown in the first picture.
You're right X1 - the tuck shown in your first picture looks to be more secure.

Yes, I find this a nice, simple solution.  There is a similar one
in which that orange end (ref. X1's image) crosses under
itself and back around over (outside of the bight) and then
is brought around for a similar under-two... tucking as shown.

Maybe better (=>'mayBEtter') is taking the orange tail under
and around the upper side, over itself (and bight leg) at top
and under itself (between it & lower bight leg) to lock at
bottom --making an overhand structure.  This good bight hitch
can be bolstered in its locking by making a full wrap/turn
around the top side before tucking (which will yet enable
forcible loosening via pulling eye/bight legs apart do draw
in SPart of the hitching line), or --if UNtying isn't important--
simply repeating the going around and tucking step,
to put on a 2nd course of binding, thus.  It will need this
added security in some common, slick materials.

Quote
This Becket replacement arose because my grandson was trying to attach a length
of split film polypropylene to a 10" spliced eye in manila (for reasons best known
only to a 9 year old!).  The poly rope is stiff and slippery so when I showed him
how to tie a Becket Hitch it sprang loose once tension was released (even doubled).
... and there went the value of granDad in young eyes!!   :-[   ::)   ;D



 :)

X1

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Re: Becket Hitch replacement
« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2013, 05:35:58 PM »
There is a similar one
in which that orange end (ref. X1's image) crosses under itself and back around over (outside of the bight) and then is brought around for a similar under-two... tucking as shown.
Maybe better... is taking the orange tail under and around the upper side, over itself (and bight leg) at top and under itself (between it & lower bight leg) to lock at bottom --making an overhand structure.  This good bight hitch can be bolstered in its locking by making a full wrap/turn around the top side before tucking (which will yet enable forcible loosening via pulling eye/bight legs apart do draw in SPart of the hitching line), or --if UNtying isn't important-- simply repeating the going around and tucking step, to put on a 2nd course of binding... 

   I had chosen the particular second alternative just because its tying pattern is easy to memorize ( each tucking end passes "under" the previous one, each round turn turns around the other leg ).
   If, instead of trying to show by talking, you were trying to talk by showing, the world would have been much simpler...  Or those batteries have not been charged yet ?
« Last Edit: March 16, 2013, 05:36:57 PM by X1 »

Dan_Lehman

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Re: Becket Hitch replacement
« Reply #11 on: March 17, 2013, 05:11:20 AM »
   If, instead of trying to show by talking, you were trying to talk by showing,
the world would have been much simpler...

But I resist contributing to the poverty of this world's
grasp of language; "simple" has its pejorative sense.
"A picture is worth a thousand words" has now some
chance of being tested in terms of bit-wise equivalence.
Besides, that clear image of yours is good for reference
duty and needs no other competing with it! (Though I
wince at the pains of pinned rope for photography's sake!)

(But at some other moment maybe there will come an
avalanche of "bight hitches" via a copy of a full couple
of pages.)
 ;)

--dl*
====

X1

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Re: Becket Hitch replacement
« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2013, 05:30:43 PM »
the poverty of this world's grasp of language;

  It is the poverty of this world s moral values and grasp of meanings, that should worry us. Language can be - and has been - misused more than pictures - as a powerful tool to cover up than to reveal the truth. That is the reason "talk shows" are so popular !
  Having said that, I must add that pictures are only skin deep !  :) They can not show some very important things which we need to know about a loaded knot : the distribution of forces within the material, for example. One way to do this would be to apply the experimental method of photoelasticity, on knots made of a transparent material ( acrylic, for example ) - but I do not hope that I will live long enough to see knot structures examined in such a detail...
  Bight hitches is a very interesting subject. I consider the Blackwall hitch ( tied around a hook or around a bight, which is about the same thing ) one of the most marvellous knots - so I am a little biased, and I prefer bight hitches which, essentially, are nothing more than Blackwall hitches with the addition of some "security sauce"...  :)

  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photoelasticity