Author Topic: The basic elements of any practical knot.  (Read 11261 times)

X1

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Re: The basic elements of any practical knot.
« Reply #15 on: December 12, 2012, 03:05:59 PM »
   A friend of mine has just answered to those posts by this : 
   
   " A Buddhist Monk once explained to me that one "sin" in his philosophy is "acts without merit"  - like Words without usefulness...
   For example, even speaking or reading the Buddha teaching to someone who is unable to understand or is not interested, is also words without usefulness, not useful for the other and not useful for you - as you are squandering time you could use for something "with merit"."

   This reminds me what I had thought the other day, when I was trying to make a little experiment to show this "the right angle is the right angle" conjecture of mine, on the intersections of ropes in knots.
   I had set and put two tensioned ropes meet at a right angle between two large books, then pressed the two books together, then pulled the one rope to see how strong the pull should be made in order to make the rope slip. Keeping the tension on the two ropes and the magnitude of force with which the books were pressed the one upon the other constant, I was trying to feel the effect on my hand.
   How did I manage to vary, in the first place, the magnitude of the force, so it will make the two ropes to bite each other sufficiently hard, to the point the pulled rope did not slip easily, and then keep it constant, during a stronger or weaker subsequent pull, sufficient to make the pulled rope slip  ? By placing the two books horizontally on a desk, and putting a certain number of other heavy books on them, of course... :) I call this "a thing you can learn on knots, by using books".  :)
   Well, to reach the desired weight I had used some volumes of a rare, out-of-print encyclopedia of 1932, that was offered by a friend of mine as a gift to my son, when he was born. And then, suddenly, I realized that my son never used this encyclopedia during those 17 years... and he will probably not use it ever -  so this was the first and only practical use of those books during the last 80 years. And, going one step further, I start wondering how many other books in the world have been printed, placed and arranged carefully on bookshelves, and not been used even for their f weight .... How many zillions of cut trees, printed pages, carefully chosen words, wasted, for ever, for nothing.
  So, I guess a few more words about knots in this forum wont make any difference, will they ?  If someone prints all the words spelled on this Forum, the weight of the paper would be more than enough to test the "the-right-angle-is-the-right-angle" sentence, but the carbon content of it would not - probably - be enough to warm somebody during the long cold days of the Forum s dialogue winter... 
« Last Edit: December 12, 2012, 03:10:26 PM by X1 »

SS369

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Re: The basic elements of any practical knot.
« Reply #16 on: December 12, 2012, 03:19:15 PM »
Hello X1.

Desire can be the father of invention. ;-)

And what was the outcome of the ad hoc experiment?
Did you try another angle other than the "right" angle?
What ropes did you use and were they the same size?

Do you have access to a spring scale to be able to verify and record the tension differences?
Etc....


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X1

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Re: The basic elements of any practical knot.
« Reply #17 on: December 12, 2012, 04:04:06 PM »
1. And what was the outcome of the ad hoc experiment?
2. Did you try another angle other than the "right" angle?
3. What ropes did you use and were they the same size?

4. Do you have access to a spring scale to be able to verify and record the tension differences ?

1. Guess what ... :)
2. Of course, that was the experiment !
3. Yes, I used kernmantle ropes of the same size ( that was part of the "ceteris paribus" description ), that keep their round shape. If the ropes would be able to be flattened much more / very much, it is expected that the results would have not been so pronounced.
4. It is the relative difference of the magnitude of able-to make-the-rope-slip forces that counts - because, given a strong enough pull, one can drag the whole bookself ! I wished to feel the difference, to have a haptic sensory experience of it... which is most important in knots, I believe.
It was not my intention, nor was it in my abilities, to perform a proper laboratory test. I wait for the next generation of knot tyers, that will inherit the encyclopaedias... etc. !  :)
« Last Edit: December 12, 2012, 04:05:54 PM by X1 »