Author Topic: "Lehman8" and "Zeppelin loop " - which is more difficult to untie ?  (Read 17849 times)

xarax

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Re: "Lehman8" and "Zeppelin loop " - which is more difficult to untie ?
« Reply #30 on: August 09, 2015, 08:44:05 AM »
  some half decent images

  " half decent " ... You are doing it on purpose ! OK - I decided I have to buy a new camera.
   Your images are TALKING ! :) And they look like they will start WALKING out of the paper...
   
   My opinion is that ( symmetric ) "bends" = end-to-end knots belong to a class of knots which is relatively "easy" : That is why we already have dozens of dozens of them, and it seems like we can tie any number of "new" ones we wish : by retucking the ones we already know, twisting their Standing parts around each other at one ore more points ( the crossing of "tails" is nothing but such a transformation ), etc. There also seems to be no end in sight in the Fisherman-like bends, where each link is made from one of the many known stoppers or hitches... However, I do not believe there is anything really new to discover in the field of bends : I "feel" we know everything about them - and I have to notice that, unfortunately :) , there is this great, superb other-bend-extinguisher, the ( single and double ) Zeppelin bend, which makes much of the journey to this part of KnotLand almost pointless...
   Having said that, I also want to mention that there is a new class of knots, which are very useful and interesting, and of which we know NOTHING ! The bends tied on tropes made from the very strong but also very slippery materials ( UHMWPE, poly(p-phenylene-2,6-benzobisoxazole), and all that :) :) ). I would suggest, to anybody who would like to contribute to the field of practical knotting, to offer his time to this subject, rather than the "finished" subject of bends tied on ordinary material. And the procedures I had referred to, by which we can transform and improve the already known bends, is a good starting point one can start this much-needed exploratory journey, I believe.
« Last Edit: August 09, 2015, 08:47:17 AM by xarax »
This is not a knot.

xarax

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Re: "Lehman8" and "Zeppelin loop " - which is more difficult to untie ?
« Reply #31 on: August 09, 2015, 08:52:16 AM »
   There are TWO distinct Hunter X bends ( X=crossed tails ) :
   http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=3251.msg19608#msg19608
This is not a knot.

Dan_Lehman

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Re: "Lehman8" and "Zeppelin loop " - which is more difficult to untie ?
« Reply #32 on: August 11, 2015, 08:23:01 AM »
Some photos of SmitHunter #1425A
...and also the X version with crossed tails (which seems to be jam resistant).
After asking Mark and Dan about it in private I found out
that Asher had beaten us all to it ☺
Not me in that "us" --I think I beat Asher to it by
some years, and will lay claim in any case on account
of his dismissal of it vs. the correct assessment!   >:(

 ;)

Mobius

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Re: "Lehman8" and "Zeppelin loop " - which is more difficult to untie ?
« Reply #33 on: August 12, 2015, 10:15:22 AM »
Some photos of SmitHunter #1425A
...and also the X version with crossed tails (which seems to be jam resistant).
After asking Mark and Dan about it in private I found out
that Asher had beaten us all to it ☺
Not me in that "us" --I think I beat Asher to it by
some years, and will lay claim in any case on account
of his dismissal of it vs. the correct assessment!   >:(
 
 ;)


Sorry Dan, I must have misinterpreted what you told me 😯

It is a very good knot, as good as, IMHO (if not better), than the Zeppelin. I still need some time to finish testing it, I was even thinking that I might try some 3mm Dyneema in it and see whether it holds.

Cheers,

mobius

Dan_Lehman

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Re: "Lehman8" and "Zeppelin loop " - which is more difficult to untie ?
« Reply #34 on: September 07, 2015, 06:19:35 AM »
It is a very good knot, as good as, IMHO (if not better), than the Zeppelin.
Just to be clear : I am alert to attacking what strike me
as "fan boy" raves about the z. and to advance what
IMO are often --per situation-- better knots, such as either
Ashley's (#1452) & (1425 (not "1425a")).

But, I will also remark that my keys ring is tied onto small
binding cord (a hollow braid of nylon, which semi-flattens)
closed by the z. with ends so short that their fibres are
*mushroomed*/spread against the knot body, and this
has been in place for a decade or longer** (I have no reason
to untie it) !!  --while pretty much all knots, including
a z. tied in some of the small, 3/16"(4mm?) solid
braid nylon play cords tied to this key cord (along with
a small (10') tape measure have inevitably loosened.
The holding zeppelin is by no means "tight/jammed",
but those mushroomed tails done come out, and the
knot must not take much of abrasion/rubbing the
way the slightly flattened small cord sits.
(**could be two decades!)


--dl*
===