The gripping hitch around poles, presented at:
http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=2075.msg16893#msg16893
is superior, by far, to the Pipe hitch, the Icicle hitch or the Kleimheist hitch (to name but a few...)
I have tested all the known hitches-around-poles, and then some, and I know.
Of course, I guess that there will be another half century or so, before we. the concervative knot tyers, will re-discover this fact..
But where are these test results for public consideration?
I wait to publish them after yours...
As I have said, I prefer OPT... My tests are not at the quality level I would like them to be, so I keep them to myself, for the time being.
You may prefer "OPT" ("other people's testing), but your
claim here was different --and needed to be, given it all.
So trying to wave off any serious question is just cowardly,
or what else should we call it? You, who "know" how "far
superior" something is, yet, cannot say how this rare wisdom
is to be understood?
--in terms of the test method : what materials where used
(hitching & object; cordage type & size(s)); how the various
knots' results were graded/ordered.
One can envision a test device in which the two ends of
specimen cordage are knotted in competitive hitches on
either side of some capstan-like cylinder for simultaneously
pulling each end towards it, wrapping up the line. Then,
at least in some H1-vs-H2 ordering one might see one
knot yield while the other holds.
The icicle hitch is said to grip even a tapered spike;
"Is said..." By whom ? Where are his "tests results for public considerataion" ? Did this "who-ever" tested also the hitches I have proposed, and have compared them to the hitches he knew? ( provided he now knows the hitches I have proposed..)
The demonstration of this was before a meeting of the IGKT;
it's reported in an old issue of
Knotting Matters. And that
is a point of reference for what the *knot* --some particular
entanglement of cordage to some spike-- can do: it stands
as a challenge for other hitches to equal or not --just this,
and not some sort of more *transferable* currency of hitch
performance, although it seems a considerable feat.
that hitch you show as "superior" doesn't look good enough to hold on slick pole.
"Look" ? Do you judge knots by "looking" at them ?
...
Yes, just as you do in looking at your gentle curves
in those hoped-to-be-so-strong end-2-end knots you've
put up --a naive look, devoid of any intelligent testing
to support it (and I know, for I've followed that path,
but have some testing & practical hints of its speciousness).
So, I look at your hitches and try to see how force will
flow into them, on what it will bear, how it might tighten
further, and so on --a looking that bereft of better understanding
is itself only an inchoate basis for judgement, but one that
should be made (i.e., one should make oneself forecast,
to test one's beliefs), in a sort of trial-&-error building.
It can hold on any pole because it can be pre-tightened
as much as we can tighten it even before it is loaded -
Everything can be <done as much as it can be> --that is
a mere tautology. But as for seriously tightening some
knot, that will depend upon materials: manual force will
be insignificant for much rope tightening --quite in contrast
to that in angling knotting, where setting knots to some
50% of expected break strength is sometimes expected
for getting proper results!
... And I wait your comparative tests on "knotted materials" tied with those knots.
Until then, I suggest you "look" more carefully ! So,yes, it is "superior to the Icicle hitch,
BY FAR, as you will be surprised to discover before the end of this half century...
Such childish replies serve you poorly.
As noted, I look at that (however tightened) wrapping of
cordage you advance and surmise that on loading it will
move on a tapered device and NOT have the mechanism
to increase tightening & thus grip on the reduced-radius
material and so will slip even more, to failure. Whereas
those knots that feed force into the bottom of a coil can
have some chance of rapidly constricting around such
a tapered object sufficiently to hold. (Though I remain
leery of putting much faith in them; still, one person
was brave enough to suspend himself by a now famous
hitch. (In true knotting fashion, some arborist site cites
this performance in promoting its use of the hitch, without
considering that the arborist use is to load
both ends,
unlike the single-S.Part loading that gripped the spike!))
I believe that Derek tested his hitch to a smooth pole, with a hydraulic jack?
I do not put a question mark,
when I say that Derek Smith has NOT tested the hitch I have proposed,
and has not compared it to any other hitches...using a hydraulic or not jack - just as you, I believe (?) .,
No, but what you say raises a question mark in readers,
for there's nothing there, but assertion. Derek tested ...
in that manner, with that result. Now, he didn't test
your knot; but how DID you --in what way, with what
materials and what force. For if all you did was dangle
your empty chair from a water pipe and rouse your
neighbors, we'll have a good idea of figuring which of
the these briefly tested knots has had the real challenge.
--dl*
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