Author Topic: Two half hitches versus two reversed half hitches and other hitches etc.  (Read 15197 times)

TMCD

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 257
I always read where two half hitches is recommended for many tasks, but in my knotting experiences I much prefer the look and feel of two reversed hh's. Since I'm a fisherman, I'm always debating on what hitch to use on my anchors, mooring ring, and several other tie offs around my boat. So I'm constantly testing out the Buntline, Lobster Buoy(I really like), two hh's, two reversed hh's(I really like), the fisherman's bend, the anchor bend variant etc.

In my experience's, the Anchor Bend Variant is an excellent choice for tying on small anchors. The common recommendation in the fishing community is to tie the Fisherman's Bend on your anchors, I just don't like the way the last half hitch rides. I don't care for how the last half hitch rides in the two hh's scenario either. If you'll notice, the last half hitch in both of those doesn't really get good and snug. Two reversed hh's snugs and rides the SE much more compact and tight IMO...plus looks great. I think the Lobster Buoy Hitch, Buntline Hitch, Anchor Bend Variant and two reversed hh's are much more attractive and better than the FB or two hh's.

I love fiddling around with these various hitches, what's your favorite hitch to use in these situations?  For example, if I'm towing a car, I'll probalby use a slipped Buntline or two reversed hh's. Another funny example is the fact that all four anchors in my boat have four different hitches tied to them. One's the Lobster Buoy, one's two reversed hh's, one's a buntilne and the other is the anchor bend variant. Isn't that crazy, further proof I'm a knot nut.

alpineer

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 482
I always read where two half hitches is recommended for many tasks, but in my knotting experiences I much prefer the look and feel of two reversed hh's. Since I'm a fisherman, I'm always debating on what hitch to use on my anchors, mooring ring, and several other tie offs around my boat. So I'm constantly testing out the Buntline, Lobster Buoy(I really like), two hh's, two reversed hh's(I really like), the fisherman's bend, the anchor bend variant etc.

In my experience's, the Anchor Bend Variant is an excellent choice for tying on small anchors. The common recommendation in the fishing community is to tie the Fisherman's Bend on your anchors, I just don't like the way the last half hitch rides. I don't care for how the last half hitch rides in the two hh's scenario either. If you'll notice, the last half hitch in both of those doesn't really get good and snug. Two reversed hh's snugs and rides the SE much more compact and tight IMO...plus looks great. I think the Lobster Buoy Hitch, Buntline Hitch, Anchor Bend Variant and two reversed hh's are much more attractive and better than the FB or two hh's.

I love fiddling around with these various hitches, what's your favorite hitch to use in these situations?  For example, if I'm towing a car, I'll probalby use a slipped Buntline or two reversed hh's. Another funny example is the fact that all four anchors in my boat have four different hitches tied to them. One's the Lobster Buoy, one's two reversed hh's, one's a buntilne and the other is the anchor bend variant. Isn't that crazy, further proof I'm a knot nut.

Sounds good to me TMCD. Materials change, so why not the knots tied in them.

knot4u

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1076
Do you ever use a Sailor's Hitch or a Timber Hitch?
« Last Edit: July 27, 2011, 11:02:29 PM by knot4u »

xarax

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2781
Do you ever use a Sailor's Hitch or a Timber Hitch?

  If I were asked which are the two worst, ugliest one- two- or three-wrap hitches, out of the many dozens known, I would probably have had recomended those two... :) Well, THAT is a coincidence !  :)
« Last Edit: July 27, 2011, 10:25:22 PM by xarax »
This is not a knot.

knot4u

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1076
Do you ever use a Sailor's Hitch or a Timber Hitch?

  If I were asked which are the two worst, ugliest one- two- or three-wrap hitches, out of the many dozens known, I would probably have had recomended those two... :) Well, THAT is a coincidence !  :)

To my eyes, the Sailor's Hitch and the Timber Hitch appear beautiful because of their characteristics.
« Last Edit: July 28, 2011, 03:54:42 AM by knot4u »

Hrungnir

  • Exp. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 169
Do you ever use a Sailor's Hitch or a Timber Hitch?

  If I were asked which are the two worst, ugliest one- two- or three-wrap hitches, out of the many dozens known, I would probably have had recomended those two... :) Well, THAT is a coincidence !  :)
This is near by getting off topic. But this isn't the the Decorative knot forum. The Timber Hitch is a serious candidate as the most practical hitch, and the Sailor Hitch isn't lost behind a wagon either.

I can understand that symmetrical and visually apealing would be arguments for easily recognized and controlled hitches. The Timber Hitch is however both. The Sailor Hitch is also simple enough to be easily recognized and controlled by a user which has the hitch in his/hers arsenal.

Do you ever use a Sailor's Hitch or a Timber Hitch?
The Sailor Hitch and Timber Hitch are for attaching a rope to a pole, while the hitches represented by  TMCD is superior as ring hitches. I assume that is why you suggested those two hitches :)
« Last Edit: July 28, 2011, 08:57:49 AM by Hrungnir »

knot4u

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1076
Do you ever use a Sailor's Hitch or a Timber Hitch?
The Sailor Hitch and Timber Hitch are for attaching a rope to a pole, while the hitches represented by  TMCD is superior as ring hitches. I assume that is why you suggested those two hitches :)

I'm not a sailor.  I was asking a non-rhetorical question, and not really making a suggestion.  From what I've seen on boats, there seem to be opportunities to tie a Sailor Hitch or a Timber Hitch.

The original poster seems to want to discuss hitches for "anchors, mooring ring, and several other tie offs around my boat" (first paragraph).  Then, he leaves things wide open for discussion in the third paragraph.  The original poster should clarify exactly what application(s) we should be discussing here.  For example, are we to discuss hitches to a ring, a pole, or something else?
« Last Edit: July 28, 2011, 09:16:52 AM by knot4u »

xarax

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2781
what hitch to use on my anchors, mooring ring, and several other tie offs around boat.

   I would bet that whoever devised and named the so-called "Sailor s hitch" was a landsman...and, as there are no trees growing on the sea or the ship itself, (yet... :)), it is also no wonder that the timber hitch is not-so-clever a hitch, to say the least. Unfortunately, the times of the tall ships have long gone, so we can not ask an active sailor if he he had ever used any of those two hitches on his ship.
   There are dozens, may be dozens of dozens hitches that can be fastened on poles, rings, hooks, eyes, bollards, and tied around tightened or not lines. Some of them can withstand lengthwise pull along slippery poles, which is the most difficult task for a hitch. Also, some of them can be tied in the bight, and some of them are designed so we can fasten other lines on them.
   I do not know if there was ever a scientifically sound testing of all those hitches, with marine ropes. However, this can be turned into a field of glory for the able knot tester !
« Last Edit: July 28, 2011, 10:20:47 AM by xarax »
This is not a knot.

xarax

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2781
   Just an example of what might be one of the most simple hitches (See the attached picture). An overhand knot, with marine ropes, is more than enough !  Of course, a series of half hitches would hold anything, including the sailor himself.(1)

1) http://storrick.cnc.net/VerticalDevicesPage/Ascender/KnotPages/KnotHitchSeries.html
This is not a knot.

TMCD

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 257
I'm speaking about ring hitches mainly and of course the cleat hitch is a MUST for every angler to know. But I'm also thinking about scenarios not just on the water but in other situations as well. Any situation where a person must tie on to a ring, towing a car(axle, bumper or ball hitch), hanging items up in your garage etc, requires a person to know at least one or two good hitches. When I think of a Timber Hitch, hauling a log comes to mind immediately. A sailors hitch certainly wasn't at the top of my list either, it's basically a rolling hitch isn't it?

As I stated, the most common and trusted method is simply tying two half hitches to the ring. A really good hitch that I didn't mention is the Bull Hitch. I wonder if the Bull Hitch would work for an anchor? Try backing the Bull Hitch up with an extra half hitch, talk about a super little hitch. I'm surprised the Bull Hitch is so new having been discovered in 1995. Budworth mentions the Ossel Knot which is a great little hitch as well. I love passing the time away playing with these little hitches on a good size eye bolt that I have.

It's interesting as Ashley notes, that the Buntline and two half hitches are basically a clove hitch form and two reversed hitches and the Lobster Buoy Hitch are based off of the Cow Hitch. The later two meet the look requirement better than the former two IMO. I'd love to see a series of tests done on these hitches to find out how they stack up against each other.

knot4u

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1076
Any situation where a person must tie on to a ring, towing a car(axle, bumper or ball hitch), hanging items up in your garage etc, requires a person to know at least one or two good hitches.

Of course, it all depends on the application, the rope material, etc.  Let's assume we're talking about critical applications, like towing or supporting a human body...

If I could recommend only ONE anchor as the go-to anchor, it would likely be a Round Turn and Slipped Buntline.  The Round Turn will add some strength and prevent the Slipped Buntline from getting too tight.  Meanwhile, even with the Round Turn, the Slipped Buntline can still be drawn tight enough before the real load is applied.  The Slipped Buntline would give me assurance that the worst case scenario is going to be either a jam (unlikely) or the rope will break (which depends mostly on rope strength).

In contrast, with Two Half Hitches (instead of the Slipped Buntline), there is the possibility of the knot coming loose.  That's because Two Half Hitches does NOT naturally tighten itself as the load on the standing end increases.  That may not be an issue worthy of too much concern.  However, with the Slipped Buntline, this issue is relatively non-existent.

I have some homemade gym devices that perform the critical task of supporting human bodies (300lbs+) on a daily basis.  I use a variety of anchors with the ropes.  A Slipped Buntline is not always the best.  Other anchors I have in use right now are the Timber Hitch and the Girth Hitch.  In fact, where the Girth Hitch is currently in use, I cannot think of any other anchor that would have worked better there.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2011, 06:13:48 PM by knot4u »

xarax

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2781
  If I could recommend only ONE anchor as the go-to anchor, it would likely be a Round Turn and Slipped Buntline.

  For a one-wrap simple hitch, try the Buntline extinguisher  :). (Same number of moves/tucks as the "extinguished" Buntline...(1))

  In fact, where the Girth Hitch is currently in use, I cannot think of any other anchor that would have worked there.

   For a two-wraps simple hitch, try the overhand-knot-based hitch. ( You gave to tie an overhand knot on the standing part, to tie this hitch.)(2)

1) http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=3105.msg18595#msg18595
2) http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=3197.0
« Last Edit: July 29, 2011, 11:12:32 PM by xarax »
This is not a knot.

knot4u

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1076
  In fact, where the Girth Hitch is currently in use, I cannot think of any other anchor that would have worked there.

   For a two-wraps simple hitch, try the overhand-knot-based hitch. ( You gave to tie an overhand knot on the standing part, to tie this hitch.)(2)

Thanks, but I see I have to provide a pic for others to see what I'm saying...



It's a Dip Station, among other things.  The purpose of the tensioned rope is provide stability in the back-and-forth direction.

Notice one of the Girth Hitches in the top left.  The two pipes come together at a 90 degree angle.  The tension on the rope extends from the corner along a 45 degree angle between the two joined pipes.  The legs of the Girth are split apart and gripping the corner connection perfectly.  Other knots in the pic include a Slipped Buntline and various knots within Versatackles.  I have since changed the Slipped Buntlines for Timber Hitches, but this pic is a good preview of the final product.

« Last Edit: July 30, 2011, 03:04:56 AM by knot4u »

xarax

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2781
 The two pipes come together at a 90 degree angle.  The tension on the rope extends from the corner along a 45 degree angle between the two joined pipes.

  Knot4U, having a Versatackle there, you do not need a hitch / noose ! Any fixed length double loop would do the job, and then you can eliminate the slack with the versatackle tensioning mechanism...Am I missing something here ?
This is not a knot.

knot4u

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1076
 The two pipes come together at a 90 degree angle.  The tension on the rope extends from the corner along a 45 degree angle between the two joined pipes.

  Knot4U, having a Versatackle there, you do not need a hitch / noose ! Any fixed length double loop would do the job, and then you can eliminate the slack with the versatackle tensioning mechanism...Am I missing something here ?

You're proposing a Double Loop instead of the Girth Hitch I have pictured?  Thank you for participating, but I'll stick with what I have.