Author Topic: ABOK ?  (Read 4590 times)


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« on: February 05, 2006, 04:51:27 AM »
I was wondering if there is a difference in the 1944 and the newer addition of the ABOK that I should consider befor buying one .

« Last Edit: February 05, 2006, 04:52:14 AM by seabasedm »
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Re: ABOK ?
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2006, 04:12:48 PM »
In (at least) one of the newer editions there are some mistakes taken out.

I think you can buy any version of ABOK, they all have some mistakes but they have so many more good things, they are worth the money.
Only buy a rare version for a rare books price if you are a book collector.
If you can find an ABOK for a secondhand price, grab it, do not wonder about the edition.
If you have to go for a new book, you will have to take whatever is in stock.

For those who would be able to use the german version, I have been told that there is a cheap version in German translation on its way to the market. I have been told somewhere around 20 euro, ($25?)
I have not seen it yet, and I do not know when it will hit the market, if it ever does.

« Last Edit: February 05, 2006, 04:13:54 PM by Willeke »
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Re: ABOK ?
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2006, 11:26:59 PM »
It is odd to not find indication of the date of the edition in the book
(at least this is so for some later editions) other than for the printing
numbers, which are not easy to translate to date.

In editions ca. 1984 and later, an entry for the "Hunter's Bend" has
been added, by Geoffrey Budworth, as #1425a.  There have also been
some corrections made.  But note that there are some notes about
errors made by readers, and one was recently posted to this forum.
I have heard that more recent editions lack the images of many old
beckets which had adorned the inside of the cover & facing 1st page
--a sad loss, if so.  So, perhaps a used copy ca. 1985 might be best.



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Re: ABOK ?
« Reply #3 on: February 06, 2006, 08:50:24 AM »
 Not an expert by far but have many editions from many years so and personal opinions to sink a barg:  The "front pieces", which is to say the inside photo plates in the first and last pages show the sea chest beckets, refered to in chapter 41.  They are in the 1944 and subsequent but seem to dropped off in about 19... did he say 85? in the UK edition but not until 93 in the USA edition.  There is some intermediate USA edition which has the frontpieces but has shuffled the photo plates from one place to another.  Some of the "eratta" which was corrected in the 1993 USA edition is either not errata or not worth the pen time.  Arm chair quarterbacking is a very dangerous game.  IGKT-PAB compiled a list of the eratta (errors in text) and before I could object and raise a fuss they found a second errata to confound me.
 Buy the book you can find, you will never be sad.
 Buy it damaged and weather beaten, you will always love it.
 Buy it in all its forms, if you don't like it... sell it to me.
 I bid on every one I find on Ebay.  Don't want to bid against any IGKT reader so would "back off" if you Email me.. I am always "PABPRES" on ebay.
 There is no "best of show" version of ABOK.  It is a fault of the publishing industry that it is not a precise as engineering.  You can not know what is missing from your edition... dumb publishers.  If you get one ABOK without the endpieces: then I am sure some jerk ;) in some branch will make zeerocks copies of the endpieces to snail mail to you.  Some limited copies of Knot News compilation of Knotting Matters eratta must have been stuffed in a mattress so zeerocks copies must exist ;).  I'd be happy to work with you if your book seems "odd' when you work with it.  CWA documented many of the knots know to man.  He hinted at expansion and revision (#2360 would make a good thump mat"... and then look at where HG Smith and Your's turly have taken that!).  He was a tease and had an impressive sense of humor.  He worked personal jokes and puns into the text.  However He seldom offered "Knots with no known purpose".  But he did make mistakes in text and crossed diagram lines or omitted them by mistake and I love to work on these.  Not because I am equal or better but because I am an humble student.
 Please note, since the publication dates in USA and UK are so confused, and since book sellers don't know this you will see many "first editions" offered.  Don't even remotely think it to be true.  I've got so many 1944 editions they are coming out my nose.  A true "first edition, first publication"  is hardly worth more than a current edition on Amazon or whatever.  I missed an honest to golly autographed by CWA  first ed, first pub, by less than I'd care to admit to but by far less than the current "over the counter retail USA" price.  Dumb Roy.  The 1944 was the first edition.  The first publication was therefore 1944 first ed, first pub.  I have only one first ed, first pub.
 The publication page does not always list the publication date but this thing is in book publishing.... edition vs publication.  Not verbage easily grasped by knotters.... or at least by me. Now all you book experts can come down on me and correct my stupid statements.. And I welcome that input becuase all I know is I've got 6 ABOKS on hand and have given away many,  many more (or sold at cost or less than cost or donated.. and what I have expressed above is how it seems to me.. not a book guy, just a knot guy).  Hey, by the by.. I've wanted a UK version and bid on every one but not yet won.  I know they are not the USA Doubleday version.  What are they like?  They have a different dust cover.  They often lack the frontpiece of the beckets.  Maybe a holder of ABOK UK can update me via Email.  I don't collect "The Book"... I am just a wee bit  of a fanatic.
 I would refer you to "ABOK- corrections" elswhere in this forum.  I've not compared my eratta list but many of these are surely not in the original list but are correctly brought to task.  Cheers.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2006, 09:39:29 AM by PABPRES »


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Re: ABOK ?
« Reply #4 on: February 06, 2006, 11:09:33 AM »
knudeNoggin -  Geoffrey Budworth did NOT insert Hunter's Bend in the revised ABOK - it was done by the publishers, unbeknown to him following a discussion they had with him.  Geoffrey was adamant that the book was "Ashley's Book of Knots" and should not be added to - all he did was to have those diagrams and references that were clearly mistakes amended.
Roy - the UK editions are identical in every way except that they are printed here and published by Faber and Faber rather than Doubleday.  The dust covers are different.  UK versions were printed in 1947 (First UK ed)
reprinted 1963 1967 1970 1972 1975 1977 1979 1982 1985 1988 1990 - 1st revised 1993, most I have seen are in red covers except the 1993 which is blue. And like the American version, sadly,  it has no coverplates.  



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Re: ABOK ?
« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2006, 12:11:55 PM »
I heard Jeremy Irons choosing ABOK as his book on Desert Island Discs yesterday.  He has excellent taste!


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Re: ABOK ?
« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2006, 07:18:31 AM »
Hi Gordon,
 Thank you for the clarification.  I think things sneak into print without the help of anyone.. so I am sure if GB did not intend an inclusion then the publisher picked it from ... well perhaps vodka fumes.. and this is not intended to sugest that GB had the Vodka.  Publishers can conjur text and illustrations from thin air (or vodka fumes).
 Here is my position on "eratta" after more that 45 years of ABOK:
 When I joined PAB the back issues of Knot News #13 & #14 contained lists of errata published in KM, which were compiled from back issues, (which may or may not have ended up in 1993 edition).
 Being sort of methodical I anotated my own ABOK as I came to the list of eratta.  (not to worry that the issues were years old... I must read the posts in order I receive it).  So I dutifully marked up my ABOK and then turned to the next month of KN... Only to find that errata had been modified to again.... more crossing out and more pen work resulted.
 Frankly (and most humbly) I've not taken a 1993 {which I now have several of} and worked page by page with my 1944 first pub, first ed.  Some mistakes in 1944 are so obvious that anyone can find them.  No argument and no comment is needed nor should be needed.  I am reluctant to look at the whole edition.
 The fun part of understanding possible eratta is that I discovered several "new knots"  while seeking to unfold "mistakes" in ABOK.  These were not really mistakes but I've now documented solutions to the non existant mistakes in ABOK and have published in Knot News and Knotting  Matters.  Treat me gently... These are not ABOK Knots "Corrected".  They are "inspiration from ABOK eratta..." understanding what CWA must have intendend as I misunderstood him and  going a step or two more due to my being too stupid to understand ABOK and going on to find my own solution.  So you see, even when ABOK is wrong, it stll leads to more knots.
 I am not sure where a zeerocks copy of endplates sent to fellow knotters via snail mail fits in international copyright law or morality.. but since the endplates are a part of the enjoyment of the ABOK....
« Last Edit: February 07, 2006, 07:50:32 AM by PABPRES »