Author Topic: Sailor Hitch vs. Pile Hitch  (Read 5960 times)

knot4u

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Sailor Hitch vs. Pile Hitch
« on: June 06, 2011, 10:44:28 PM »
These two hitch are different by one nip at the end.  Which hitch do you prefer?

I personally prefer the Sailor Hitch.  It seems to be a tiny bit more secure because of the extra nip of the working end.  If the Sailor Hitch is in fact more secure, I don't see why I'd want to tie a Pile Hitch (other than its quickness if there's access to the object end).

Hrungnir

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Re: Sailor Hitch vs. Pile Hitch
« Reply #1 on: June 06, 2011, 11:54:05 PM »
These two hitch are different by one nip at the end.  Which hitch do you prefer?

I personally prefer the Sailor Hitch.  It seems to be a tiny bit more secure because of the extra nip of the working end.  If the Sailor Hitch is in fact more secure, I don't see why I'd want to tie a Pile Hitch (other than its quickness if there's access to the object end).


First of all: The Pile Hitch is a middle hitch, while the Sailor Hitch is an end hitch.

In every situation you need a hitch, you can tie a Pile Hitch. The Pile Hitch is the most reasonable choice where you don't have access to the end of the rope. Because of the Pile Hitchs simplicity, it's easy and quick to tie, it's preferred in situations where you have access to the end of the object.

If you do have access to the end of the rope and not the end of the object, you will most likely prefer the Sailor Hitch. You do however have the possibility to tie a Pile Hitch, and it's not too difficult either.

The same rules apply for lengthwise pulls. A Double Pile Hitch is much more cumbersome to tie where you don't have access to the end of the object, while the Gripping Sailor Hitch is much more cumbersome where you have access to the end of the object. The Double Pile Hitch is the only reasonable option if you don't have access to the end of the rope. The Gripping Sailor Hitch has a lot more gripping strength than the Double Pile Hitch.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 12:35:53 AM by Hrungnir »

xarax

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Re: Sailor Hitch vs. Pile Hitch
« Reply #2 on: June 07, 2011, 12:05:01 AM »
   Have you compared those hitches with all the simple ABoK#1466-1471 hitches, and the more complex ABoK#1733-1762 hitches?
   I would suggest the modified ABoK#1740(b), instead of ABoK#1740. See (1).

1). http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=3016.0
This is not a knot.

Dan_Lehman

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Re: Sailor Hitch vs. Pile Hitch
« Reply #3 on: June 07, 2011, 07:43:52 AM »
First of all: The Pile Hitch is a middle hitch, while the Sailor Hitch is an end hitch.

The pile hitch is (also?) an end hitch --which is
probably the most likely place a hitch is needed, by far.

Quote
In every situation you need a hitch, you can tie a Pile Hitch.

Not for tying to a ring with the middle of a rope, say.
(One could tie a doubled version with a bight, perhaps;
this is pretty much the only approach.)

Quote
The Pile Hitch is the most reasonable choice where you don't have access to the end of the rope.
{and ...} where you have access to the end of the object.

Although in this case one can tie the sailor's hitch, too.

--dl*
====

Hrungnir

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Re: Sailor Hitch vs. Pile Hitch
« Reply #4 on: June 07, 2011, 11:26:10 PM »
The pile hitch is (also?) an end hitch --which is
probably the most likely place a hitch is needed, by far.
I do agree with you Lehman. But you would very seldom use the end of the rope to tie a Pile Hitch. Do we have any hitches which can be used as a middle hitch only?

Quote from: "Dan_Lehman
Quote
The Pile Hitch is the most reasonable choice where you don't have access to the end of the rope.
{and ...} where you have access to the end of the object.


Although in this case one can tie the sailor's hitch, too.
Absolutley. I haven't seen any instructions on this tying method, but I'm able to tie it after studying the structure of the knot. However, I do find the Pile Hitch outperforming the Sailor Hitch in simplicity when this tying method is required.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 11:33:39 PM by Hrungnir »

knot4u

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Re: Sailor Hitch vs. Pile Hitch
« Reply #5 on: June 07, 2011, 11:46:31 PM »
I do agree with you Lehman. But you would very seldom use the end of the rope to tie a Pile Hitch.

Well, why not?  The Pile is just as easy (or easier) to tie as end hitch than is the Sailor.  It's also a matter of which knot is more secure, thus my original question.  If someone wants to simplify to fewer knots in their library, a strong argument could be made for preferring the Pile because it's more versatile.

pros and cons, to each his own, etc...
« Last Edit: June 07, 2011, 11:53:21 PM by knot4u »

Hrungnir

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Re: Sailor Hitch vs. Pile Hitch
« Reply #6 on: June 08, 2011, 12:08:46 AM »
I do agree with you Lehman. But you would very seldom use the end of the rope to tie a Pile Hitch.

Well, why not?  The Pile is just as easy (or easier) to tie as end hitch than is the Sailor.
I'm sorry I didn't make myself clear enough. I was referring to the tying method. You don't use the (working) end of the rope to tie the knot like you do with the Sailor Hitch. You just grab the middle of the rope, roundturn and put the bight over the object. No working end involved.
« Last Edit: June 08, 2011, 12:10:10 AM by Hrungnir »

knot4u

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Re: Sailor Hitch vs. Pile Hitch
« Reply #7 on: June 08, 2011, 06:12:50 AM »
You don't use the (working) end of the rope to tie the knot like you do with the Sailor Hitch. You just grab the middle of the rope, roundturn and put the bight over the object. No working end involved.

That is, if the object end is available.

As an end hitch when the object end is unavailable, I recently discovered the Pile is easier to tie and remember than is the Sailor.  I'm talking about taking the working end and weaving it around.

 

anything