Author Topic: Interlocking knots  (Read 41337 times)

rusty427

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Re: Interlocking knots
« Reply #15 on: January 17, 2011, 12:23:38 PM »
Hey Xarax, excellent pictures! I like "The Oyster".

I will add this to my repertoire. Knot tying is a personal  expression of what one likes, it stimulates the mind and provides great satisfaction. I like to recognize my work in the wild, I saw some today that are a couple of years old, still functioning. I will be sure to leave "The Oyster" some where on the water front for you. It could make a pretty loop too!

Rusty
« Last Edit: January 17, 2011, 07:59:05 PM by rusty427 »

SS369

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Re: Interlocking knots
« Reply #16 on: January 17, 2011, 04:30:31 PM »
Thanks for reinstalling these and adding the corrections as well Xarax.

I liked the "Oyster" bend and forgot to capture the image.

SS

knot4u

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Re: Interlocking knots
« Reply #17 on: January 17, 2011, 07:11:59 PM »
Xarax, thank you for re-posting your pics.  Some folks would like to imagine your pics have no value, but your pics certainly do.  This forum is more valuable with your pics here.  For example, your pics (now removed) of the Gleipnir made that knot click for me, and now the Gleipnir is one of my favorite knots.  After that, I started to pay more attention to the knots you post.

SS369

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Re: Interlocking knots
« Reply #18 on: January 20, 2011, 08:56:38 PM »
Since we/I have jump into interlocking overhands I thought I would move the answer in  the thread over in  "Wanted : A bend for very stiff ropes" http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=2154.msg16306;topicseen#new to right here. Could be here and there, but this is my choice.

Xarax:

I am surprised at your disliking this "bend"? LOL To create what I mentioned in the other thread, the re-tucked ABOK2421 twofold overhand bend, AKA two strand Mathew Walker knot, all that I have done was to chase the working ends through the middle paralleling the first go. Gently pulling and snugging on both SP and WE as I pressed the coils into place.
Not necessarily the easiest to form up in the way of bends, but some just take a little work.
Close up picture has SP and WE indicated.

Mind you, this has not been loaded very much, just opposing hard pulls by hands.

SS

SS369

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Re: Interlocking knots
« Reply #19 on: January 20, 2011, 10:41:11 PM »
Tie it single, pull it closed some leaving room for the re-tuck and then take each WE and follow its respective part inside the collars so they, the working ends are side by side.

See if this picture helps any.
Newly tied two colors, imposed on the original picture and labeled parts.
It do look symmetrical. ;-)

SS
« Last Edit: January 20, 2011, 10:41:42 PM by SS369 »

xarax

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Re: Interlocking knots
« Reply #20 on: January 21, 2011, 06:48:28 PM »
   Thank you SS369,
   After your last post, I realized that I had NOT tied this bend till now, and I tried to follow your instructions.
  I came up with three :), slightly different, re-tucked true lovers bends, and I wonder which is the one you describe, if it is any at all ! LOL
  1. You tie a tightened single true lovers bend.
  2. You pull the (initial) colars to make some room, alongside the central axis, for the re-tucking of two tails.
  3. You pass the two tails ( that are now your working ends) around the standing ends, to form two (new) colars. Otherwise the tails would slip, and disappear, into the knot, if they would be pulled by the their free ends.
  4. Then, you pass the two working ends through the central opening of the loosened knot s nub, in opposite orientations, parallel to the central axis.
  5. You end up with a re-tucked true lovers bend, where the tails and the standing ends of each of the two ropes are adjacent, parallel, and coming out of the knot from the same side.

   When one has completed the collar forming stage, he has three options in the way he can pass the working ends through the central opening. The working ends can go through the knots nub in a crossing or in two non-crossings ways. I have labeled these two re-tcking ways the S(x) ( x: crossing of the tails just before they exit the knot s nub) and the S(1) and S(2). The crossed tails way produces a slightly larger, in volume, knot, as expected.
   Although these knots are somehow symmetric, they are not as much symmetric as the original bend. In the S(1) and S(2) case, we have two symmetric to each other links, but in the S(x) we have the aditional complication of the two tails crossing each other from oposite sides.
   I had previously tied many different re-tucked nots, starting from the same true lovers knot, but my philosophy was different. I any place within the knot I saw a pair of two adjacent rope strands, I tried to "feed" it  by a third strand going adjacent to the original two. I had tried to find a path inside, or around, the knot s nub, so the re-tucked tails pass by this place. My initial purpose was to have nipping loops going around three rope diameters, in the spirit of my original question about bends suitable for stif ropes. So, I have been tying very different knots, and I overlooked those three you have suggested.

   P.S. 2011-1-22 : I have completely mis-understood the simple set of re-tucking rules offered to me by SS369, so I have tied completely different knots ! Read the following posts, where I was finally able to understand what has been told to me right from the begining... :)
http://igkt.net/sm/index.php?topic=1919.msg16373#msg16373
 

« Last Edit: January 24, 2011, 09:19:16 AM by xarax »
This is not a knot.

xarax

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S(1) re-tucked true lovers bend
« Reply #21 on: January 21, 2011, 06:50:18 PM »
S(1) re-tucked true lovers bend
« Last Edit: February 03, 2011, 06:38:05 PM by xarax »
This is not a knot.

xarax

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S(2) re-tucked true lovers bends
« Reply #22 on: January 21, 2011, 06:54:33 PM »
S(2) re-tucked true lovers bends
« Last Edit: February 03, 2011, 07:12:46 PM by xarax »
This is not a knot.

SS369

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Re: Interlocking knots
« Reply #23 on: January 22, 2011, 05:43:21 AM »
These are interesting Xarax.

have you loaded them at least as much as you can by hand and how well do they untie?
See any real advantages to the added interplay of the diameters and thickness?


The version I tied and photographed looks the same both sides, just the colors are reversed.
But is a neat compact knot once dressed, even though there are increased diameters.
I'll have to load mine heavily and see how it unties.

SS

SS369

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Re: Interlocking knots
« Reply #24 on: January 22, 2011, 06:33:47 PM »
Good day Xarax,

I have retied and rephotographed and here are the results.
I don't think it is Identically symmetrical in Every way, every view, from all angles, but then after twisting, turning, wrestling with the larger rope my eyes are crossed. ;-)

IMHO, in my mind it should be though since they are identical knots just opposing and interlocked.
Then again I may be just to close to it for now.
Anybody have an opinion?

SS
« Last Edit: January 22, 2011, 06:48:22 PM by SS369 »

xarax

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Re: Interlocking knots
« Reply #25 on: January 22, 2011, 07:37:48 PM »
  Beautiful knot, beautiful pictures ! Congratulations ! You did it BECAUSE you have not followed your instructions, as I did !  :) You pass the tails/working ends AROUND the knot s nub, before you make them enter inside it, and pass them through the central opening. This is a very natural, very useful re-tucking, and offers nice, VERY wide standing parts (first) curves, around five (5 !) rope diameters ! Smaller than the re-tucked water bend, completely symmetric links...Beautiful ! Delete the previous pictures, this is perfect ! You should move the post back to its original place, because this bend is a beautiful answer to my stif rope bend question !  :) But no, post it in a new thread that it deserves.  
« Last Edit: January 22, 2011, 07:59:06 PM by xarax »
This is not a knot.

SS369

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Re: Interlocking knots
« Reply #26 on: January 22, 2011, 08:54:19 PM »
Thanks Xarax.

Going back over my "instructions", poor as they were, they still made sense to Me. LOL
I am glad you hooked up with what I had tied and ineptly described and had success. It must have been the picture of the exploded knot that spoke the thousand words. ;-)

I think that I will leave all this here because it is germane to the thread's topic line.
These are interlocking knots (of the same type).
The preceding pictures led the way to here and some may get ideas from those as well. (And that is very important)

If someone would like to discuss the merits(?) of this as a useful bend, in the realm of a permanent connector, e.g., the double fisherman's bend, we can take it elsewhere if we care to.

It is kind of pretty.  :-)

SS

SaltyCracker

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Re: Interlocking knots
« Reply #27 on: January 23, 2011, 12:11:08 AM »
Might as well throw the doubled granny knot into this mix...

SS369

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Re: Interlocking knots
« Reply #28 on: January 23, 2011, 12:29:35 AM »
Hello SaltyCracker,
thanks for throwing in.

At least we're thinking about this.
Do you think that the Granny re-tucked has anything to it that makes it better or worse?
Would you use it for anything?

SS

SaltyCracker

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Re: Interlocking knots
« Reply #29 on: January 23, 2011, 04:06:49 AM »
It's ABoK #779 turned into a bend instead of a two-strand lanyard knot. Discovered it when trying to figure out the knot in Norman Rockwell's "We Have a Job to Do" painting... not the turk's head the other one.

http://www.scouters.us/images/r1944.jpg

It's not the one in the painting, just one that was considered.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2011, 04:09:58 AM by SaltyCracker »