Author Topic: What's its name?  (Read 11602 times)

Jimbo

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Re: What's its name?
« Reply #15 on: September 19, 2005, 08:02:22 PM »
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Darn, I knew if you got an ABOK in your hands there would be no stopping you!

And THANK YOU for beating me with a knot-covered stick until I did!
Thank you all, for everything.  As of 6/6/6, I have changed my password to a random string (which I forgot), thereby assuring that anyone posting as "Jimbo" in the future will NOT be me.  Good luck!!!

Jimbo

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Re: What's its name?
« Reply #16 on: September 19, 2005, 08:24:58 PM »
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"What a difference a twist makes", said PABPRES. Oh, so true!


Thank you for more of your customary kind remarks!

As to (at least) one difference, here's where I get to share one of my "tricks"...

As I mentioned, when I build shelter outdoors I hang smallish cordage from whatever is available.  (Okay, it helps to live in/near the oldest mountains on Earth -- lots of trees.)

This makes a custom-tailored framework for tarps, netting, whatever.  If you must have a tent, think of my trick as your "giant rain fly"...

Anyway, as you can imagine, there are a lot of places where one "rib" needs to fasten to the middle of a span.

You can flippy-twist-tuck a loop as I have been doing, but most of the time I need to keep some tension on the SPart -- both for alignment and for not dropping the whole mess to the ground or worse.  Try that with #1038!  I'm getting the knack for tying them "11/2-handed"!!

And sometimes I need to graft a "rib" onto an existing structure, if a new friend shows up & wants to share.  I can make a #1038 or #1053 there, as I've done so many times (One downside to living in the oldest mountains on Earth: there are a LOT of people here!!!! :().

But Jaques' "Noeud réglable de boucle" (ABOK #1021 to my rheumy old eye) will let me hold whatever tension I want, precisely where I want it, and should behave itself well through the outing.  And when I practice them indoors with cordage strung from the freezer door to the cook's leg, this trick (Slip Knot with snubbing loop from the slipping side) "just comes out of my hands", just the way I like 'em!! ;D ;D ;D

ABOK #1038 can "get you there", and (if tied correctly, as PABPRES would do instinctively) makes a really nice loop knot (the sliding apart of the two component knots makes untying a treat) with a "bonus" of using those two sliding "True Lover's" knots to snub a bight of (e.g.) a ferret leash, lantern lanyard, or trash bag.  All without disturbing whatever is hanging in the "raison d'être" loop.

I plan to use the #1021 for the "back" dropper loops, and the #1038 for the "front" ones, where I might need a "3rd hand" to hold a flashlight...  For that matter, the "raison d'être" loop of #1038 can slip to hold a flashlight or pole or nephew!!

Thanks and all praise to you All, for leading me here!!  Now let's go camping!


Jimbo
Thank you all, for everything.  As of 6/6/6, I have changed my password to a random string (which I forgot), thereby assuring that anyone posting as "Jimbo" in the future will NOT be me.  Good luck!!!

ptitroy

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Re: What's its name?
« Reply #17 on: September 21, 2005, 01:07:55 AM »
Thanks to everyone for your answers.
>Jimbo: I'm going to try to give you some answers but my English is far in my memory too
Thanks a lot for your links This will be useful to create a lexicon translation especially to write messages on this forum.
First a question: What is ABOK#xxxx? Reference from Ashley book?
As I told, I am not a knot tyer, I do not know really the French words so it will be difficult for me to be clear in English.
>Nautile: if I write something wrong please help me.
I bought a translation of knot book by Geoffrey Budworth while I wrote in the French forum . A lot of knot has different names according to the uses they have, the region, the books or websites or knot-boards  in which you find them. Add errors and mistakes, it's terrible. If you have this book perhaps the numbers and references of figures and knot are the same.
·      "Starter" is slip knot=>in French: "noeud coulant simple"  or "noeud d'oiseau" depending on which end is the running end. In this case, perhaps "noeud d'oiseau"? Fig 19 C or D (knot book by Geoffrey Budworth )
·      Overhand Loop Knot,=> "noeud  de plein poing"
·      "demi clé à capeler"=> " Un tour mort et deux demi-clés " a "demi-clé"=> half hitch is done to go from 1to2 and from 2 to3 => a round turn and two half hitch? " à capeler " is a bit wrong I think: ( from old French  cap: chief or head) means thrown over the head of something,  a bollard...according to inland mariners talking in south of France (capeler: throw a loop over a bollard) in this case you can't "capeler"
·      "Noeud de glissade et un demi clé à capeler"=> N½ud coulant et une demi clé à capeler. Perfect! You can already tie it before you see any picture=>slipknot and half hitch? Over-loop half-hitched slipknot?
·      In a french forum one told me it's a "noeud tendeur" used to camping
In  knot book by Geoffrey Budworth it's "noeud d'oiseau renforcé" or "noeud à paquet" Fig 19 G used as stopping knot to pack with a string.


How could I imagine that this message show me how many knots do exist and how serious and complex is the science (art?) of knot tying.
I first tied it (after several unsuccessful and ridiculous tries) to obtain a non-slipping loop in the middle of a rope.
The slipknot is one of the knots I know. Child, I named it "magic knot" because you can make it disappear by pulling both ends. I added half hitch to avoid slipping of the loop.
Now, I use it very often as loop, stopping knot when a big one is necessary, even to carry out a kind of tackle.

Please, tell me more about ABOK#xxxx? I can't understand half of what you write :-[

Sorry again about my English: I know there is a lot of mistakes but I don't know where!!!

Regards

Jacques, perhaps knot tyer in a next futur

Jimbo

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Re: What's its name?
« Reply #18 on: September 21, 2005, 10:05:26 AM »
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First a question: What is ABOK#xxxx? Reference from Ashley book?

Yes.

When words (or entire languages) get in the way, the Ashley Book Of Knots (ABOK) serves as a convenient "shorthand" way of referring to a certain knot.  Clifford Ashley documented, categorized and numbered almost every way possible to put kinks in cord.

In "the old days", before the WWWeb, knot tyers would write to each other on paper.  Needless to say, artistry is rare, but Ashley's book of pictures is at every library.  The "shorthand" of referring to the numbers Ashley used kept busy knotters from having to describe each knot -- sometimes in different languages.

Mr. Budworth's books are very fine; but Ashley's is the "Reference Standard".  I have two of Mr. Budworth's books, and the only "complaint" (if you could call it that) I have is his use of the word "Complete".  They're not, but who cares?  They're very fine.

The ABOK is written in English, although there may be French translations; but the numbers are the same in any language.




Oui.

Quand les mots (ou les langues entières) obtiennent de la manière, le livre d'Ashley des noeuds (ABOK) sert de manière commode d'"sténographie" à de se rapporter à un certain noeud. Clifford Ashley documenté, classé et numéroté par catégorie presque chaque manière possible de mettre des replis en corde.

En "vieux jours", avant le WWWeb, les tyers de noeud écriraient entre eux sur le papier. Inutile de dire, l'art est rare, mais le livre d'Ashley des images est à chaque bibliothèque. L'"sténographie" à de se rapporter aux nombres Ashley a employé des knotters occupés gardés de devoir décrire chaque noeud -- parfois dans différentes langues.

Les livres de M. Budworth's sont très bons ; mais Ashley est la "norme de référence". J'ai deux de livres de M. Budworth's, et la seule "plainte" (si vous pourriez l'appeler qui) que j'ai est son utilisation du mot "accomplissent". Ils ne sont pas, mais qui s'inquiète ? Ils vont très bien.

L'ABOK est écrit en anglais, bien qu'il puisse y avoir des traductions françaises ; mais les nombres sont les mêmes en n'importe quelle langue.

(Translation into French by Babelfish.  Vous pouvez traduire d'anglais-français là aussi!)
Thank you all, for everything.  As of 6/6/6, I have changed my password to a random string (which I forgot), thereby assuring that anyone posting as "Jimbo" in the future will NOT be me.  Good luck!!!

nautile

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Re: What's its name?
« Reply #19 on: September 21, 2005, 12:28:15 PM »
Salut Jacques / Ptitroy

Training time for english and french language

D'abord, je trouve que tu ne te debrouille pas si mal que ça en anglais ecrit.
First, I find that you do not do so badly writing in english

Heureuseument les gars/filles ici font des efforts pour comprendre ce que l'on ecrit, alors ne soit pas timide, ca vaut le coup.
Fortunately guys/girls here make an effort to understand what we write, so do not be shy, it is worth it.

Ensuite, Jimbo a raison, le LGLDNDA ( that is ABOK in french for you : Le Grand Livre Des Noeuds De Ashley ) est incontournable
Jimbo is right, ABOK is "inescapable".

This book make for shorter and safer communication. Et rien ne l'a surpassé, et certainement pas le "copieurs"
Avec ce livre la communication est plus rapide et plus sure. No book has outdone it, and certainly not the many copy-cat books ( of which Mr Budworth is not)



La maniere francaise te la maniere anglaise de "classer" les noeuds sont tres differentes et notre "carte mentale" est tres differente.
The french and english way to "classify" knots are quite different from each other and ou "mind map" is very different.

Attention aux traducteurs en ligne, le resultat peut etre tres bizarre. Petit test de controle : traduite d'une langue vers une autre et demander au traducteur de traduire le resultat obtenu dans la langue d'origine. Amusement garanti sur un texte un peu long..
Mais c'est beauxcoup mieux que rien et permet de se comprendre   75%.

Beware of on line translation, results can be quite queer. Little control test : translate from one language to another and with the  resulting text ask for a translation back into the original language. Fun guaranteed on a text with a few sentences. But it is much better than nothing and make for a 75% understanding. But beware of the remaining 25%.

Si tu peux en supporter le cout : achete le LGLDNDA et la ABOK comme ça tu pourras ( avec certaines reserves l  aussi) te faire ton education bilingue. Je te mets ici des liens. Et n'achete pas d'autres livres qui t'equilibrerout to depense.
If you can afford the cost, buy un LGLDNDA et/and one ABOK, you will be able ( with some reserves) make your bilingual education.Do not buy other book, that will make for the cost incured.

Go and see on www.bookfinder.com ( the very best there is if you are trying to find a book new or used) they have english and french sections
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English :

http://www.bookfinder.com

et author = ashley ou laisser vide
title = ashley book of knots

The lowest price is ( without shipping cost) 25 euros- about USD30.50


French  il faut cliquer sur l'option "french"

auteur = ashley
titre = le grand livres des noeuds
le prix le plus bas est 46 euros,   peu prés  USD50

Tu peux essayer sur eBay mais il y a de fortes chances que ca revienne a beaucoup plus cher.
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Ma proposition tient toujours ( et vaut aussi pour d'autres ) utilise mon e-mail et donne moi ton adresse postale et je ferais un CD avec mes documents en anglais et en francais. Les lois sur "la propriete intellectuelle m'interdisent de lamettre sur mon espace web.
Seul l'usage privé est tolere.
My offer still stand ( and is good for others too ) use my e-mail and give me your postal address? I will burn a CD of my documentation in english and in french. Copyright and intellectual property laws forbid that I put it in my web space for downloading.Only private use allowed.

Voil , c'est tout.
Here you are, finished

PS : Jimbo that was fun the fir / cat answer, burst out laughing with the last remark put there to reassure me about your deep respect for firs!
    Thanks for further tips on BBcode coloring! Pot of gold at the end of the rainbow ?

ptitroy

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Re: What's its name?
« Reply #20 on: September 25, 2005, 12:19:22 AM »
Thanks

I'm waiting for my ABOK  in fact I bought "LGLDNDA" first.

Nautile: I'll write you about your offer. Does it include english mind map?  ;)
You're right about online translation: PS became Picosecond ::)

Regards