Author Topic: Revised Bowline on a Bight  (Read 9692 times)

travism

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Revised Bowline on a Bight
« on: March 29, 2009, 01:53:10 AM »
I took a rappelling class last weekend and we were given a list of knots to learn.  There is one knot, the revised bowline on a bight, that is new and I can't find any information other than what I was given in class on how to tie it.  I have attached a picture of the steps to tie the knot, does anyone know where to find a video or better pictures?

alpineer

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Re: Revised Bowline on a Bight
« Reply #1 on: March 29, 2009, 04:03:54 AM »
Very interesting travism. Where do you hail from?

I haven't seen anything on the net regarding this variation on the bight. DAN? DEREK?...
« Last Edit: March 29, 2009, 04:05:58 AM by alpineer »

travism

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Re: Revised Bowline on a Bight
« Reply #2 on: March 29, 2009, 04:11:17 AM »
I am from Tennessee in the US.

Were you able to tie this from the diagram?

Mike

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Re: Revised Bowline on a Bight
« Reply #3 on: March 29, 2009, 04:29:11 AM »
What part of Tennessee?   I'm just across the border in GA.   Which rappelling class did you attend?

travism

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Re: Revised Bowline on a Bight
« Reply #4 on: March 29, 2009, 04:32:07 AM »
I am from Oak Ridge, in East Tennessee.  The rappalling class I took was in Fort Payne, AL at True Adventure Sports.

Mike

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Re: Revised Bowline on a Bight
« Reply #5 on: March 29, 2009, 04:39:19 AM »
If your interested in anymore classes, I recommend "On Rope 1" in Chattanooga.   

http://onrope1.com/training.htm

alpineer

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Re: Revised Bowline on a Bight
« Reply #6 on: March 29, 2009, 06:54:29 AM »
I am from Tennessee in the US.

Were you able to tie this from the diagram?

Yes, no problem.
What advantage(s) over the standard BoaB did your instructor claim for this knot?

travism

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Re: Revised Bowline on a Bight
« Reply #7 on: March 29, 2009, 06:21:56 PM »
I don't recall what advantage the revised BoaB is supposed to have.  I just can't seem to be able to tie it, I have tried several times, but I must be doing something wrong.

alpineer

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Re: Revised Bowline on a Bight
« Reply #8 on: March 29, 2009, 08:21:23 PM »
I don't recall what advantage the revised BoaB is supposed to have.  I just can't seem to be able to tie it, I have tried several times, but I must be doing something wrong.

Try this. Tie the standard BoaB fisrt. Then, as in step 3 of the .pdf, separate the 2 lines (which are now the central double loops of the BoaB) and pull the 2 lines through them (per step 4). You will now have the revised BoaB.   
 
« Last Edit: March 29, 2009, 08:24:21 PM by alpineer »

travism

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Re: Revised Bowline on a Bight
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2009, 02:13:46 AM »
If anyone could provide me a digital video of them tying this knot or an antimated example I would be willing to pay you.  I could then post the video or animation to the web for all to see.

capt larry

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Re: Revised Bowline on a Bight
« Reply #10 on: March 30, 2009, 07:18:08 PM »
travism,

Can't do a video but offer these instructions.  I assume you can get to pix 3.  At this point, hold the knot in your right hand with the loop facing away from you.  Separate the two lines as shown in pix 3.  With your left hand grasp the two legs of the loop with your thumb and forefinger and pull the loop part way out.  Next grasp the top of the loop with your right hand and fold it down on top of your left thumb and forefinger.  Next reach through the loop with your right hand and take the two lines from your left hand and pull the loop  over the whole knot until it touches the standing parts.  Dress the knot by pulling on the two loops in your right hand and the standing parts.

The burning question still remains: Why was this taught, as presumably, a better Botb?  I find it more difficult to tie and fussy to properly dress.  Has it been tested?  Is it stronger than the traditional?  Ashley thinks quite highly of Botb #1074 et seq.

Note that Ashley #1100 is said to be preferable Botb, particularly where it will concern life and safety, though it is more difficult to tie.  Brion Toss recommends #1100 for use as Bosun's Chair to take a man aloft.

Is it possible to contact the instructor and get answers?

Dan_Lehman

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Re: Revised Bowline on a Bight
« Reply #11 on: March 31, 2009, 01:56:24 AM »
I took a rappelling class last weekend and we were given a list of knots to learn.  There is one knot, the revised bowline on a bight, that is new and I can't find any information other than what I was given in class on how to tie it.  I have attached a picture of the steps to tie the knot, does anyone know where to find a video or better pictures?
Those photos should be able to get you there.
What happens is that in one step one begins to pull out doubled rope,
which will become the twin eyes of the knot; what you need to do
--which might be unclear to you-- is to pass the tip of the bight
AROUND these parts (I call this "doing the backflip ) and then
continue drawing them out.  The backflipped bight now locks off
the eyes.

Yes, it would be nice to have a rationale for this knot.
Also, note that there are TWO ends:  which one is to be loaded,
or is it supposed to not matter?

--dl*
====

Dan_Lehman

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Re: Revised Bowline on a Bight
« Reply #12 on: April 02, 2009, 01:49:08 AM »
I took a rappelling class last weekend and we were given a list of knots to learn.
There is one knot, the revised bowline on a bight, that is new and ...

... you et al. should do well to forget this knot.  (We're still waiting to learn why
the knot was recommended; but on a cursory glance, I see little to like and enough
to dislike in it, esp. in light of alternatives.)  (I have a feeling that someone took
interest in the departure from same ol' and found fancy in it for that reason.)

Here's what you SHOULD be learning and using vice the BoaB:

www.karashknot.com/

 :)