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plafond knot variation challenge

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KnotMe:
I was thinking about the plafond knot and how few variations on that theme there are (Chinese Knotting 3 has 2).  So I decided to play around a bit.  I've started a sequence of posts on my blog about the topic (http://www.knottynotions.com/dpp/extra-simple) and give you a sneak preview of the result.  What else can we as a group come up with together?  I have a couple of other ideas brewing...  8)

KnotMe:
Over on Knot Heads (http://www.khww.net/forum/viewthread.php?thread_id=941&pid=9164#post_9161) a respondent shared a familiar looking picture and a key phrase "tong xin zao jing" which I interpreted as "同心藻井" or "same heart plafond" which allows us to search and find:

step by step how-to: http://www.51diyshop.com/article.php?id=116

image of a 3 heart plafond (scroll down a ways): http://diy.txriver.com/dispbbs.asp?BoardID=20&replyID=32248&id=2709&star=2&skin=0

images of bracelets wiht the 2 heart plafond: http://www.cncraftinfo.com/product/product_detail-id-64049-bs-lxf_ChineseKnot.html

Rrok007:
Well now that we know that the plafond knot can be done in two to three hearts, I suspect it won't take much to be able to make four hearts. What would be nice is to find a weaving method that forms the same shape, but allows one to go lengthwise, so as to form a belt or sash out of such a knot.

Rrok007:
Well, I gotta ask about applying Darwinism to this chanllange? How far do we go within the definition of 'variation' before we've created a whole new knot?

Regardless as to whether it has 2 strands or a hundred, the Matthew Walker is still a Matthew Walker. However, at at least one or two additional twists to one side, and a square knot becomes a surgeon's knot. Sure it's a variation, but it's also recognized as it's own knot.

How many 'hearts' and in what configuration/shapes before we consider ourselves as having an entirely new creature?

Sweeney:
I tend to think of complex knots such as the Plafond as "designs" rather than "knots" -  a bit like the infinite variations in the design of a knitted sweater which is still known as a sweater albeit with some pattern types having names (eg Fair isle or Aran). Whereas it can be important to identify a bend, hitch etc by name, it makes sense to have the term "Plafond" to describe a knot pattern type, rather than a specific knot, identified by some significant feature eg the number of hearts as we do with the Matthew Walker where the number of strands distinguishes different formations. Otherwise the naming of knots will get into a worse mess than it is already.

Barry

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